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Thu Dec 7, 2017, 01:45 AM

Canada Dumps Boeing Fighter Jet Deal Over Trade Dispute With US

Published time: 6 Dec, 2017 13:52

Plans to buy 18 Boeing Super Hornet fighter jets have been scrapped by the Canadian government due to the deepening dispute with the US aerospace company, sources told Reuters.

According to the sources, next week Ottawa will announce it intends to acquire a used fleet of older Australian F-18 jets. It’s the same type of plane the Royal Canadian Air Force currently operates.

The move comes in response to a 220 percent tariff placed the US on Canadian aircraft manufacturer Bombardier after Boeing accused the company of dumping airliners on the American market. The Premier of Canada's Quebec Province Philippe Couillard has blasted Boeing, accusing the company of unfairly trying to destroy Bombardier. Ottawa has slammed the company for not acting as a trusted partner.

The trade dispute comes at a time when the United States and Canada are deadlocked in negotiations over the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) which, according to US President Donald Trump has not done enough to protect US jobs.

The future of Boeing’s military sales in Canada is also on hold. According to the US firm, its commercial and defense operations in Canada support more than 17,000 Canadian jobs.

Ottawa says Bombardier is the latest victim of Donald Trump administration's trade policies, seeking to impose stiffer import penalties on a number of Canadian industries that Washington accuses of receiving government subsidies.

more...

https://www.rt.com/business/412120-canada-wont-buy-boeing/

56 replies, 446 views

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Arrow 56 replies Author Time Post
Reply Canada Dumps Boeing Fighter Jet Deal Over Trade Dispute With US (Original post)
RCW2014 Thursday OP
Banshee 3 Actual Thursday #1
Troll2 Thursday #4
Will Morningstar Saturday #13
oflguy Saturday #26
Will Morningstar Saturday #30
Badsamm Thursday #2
Will Morningstar Saturday #15
DoDaMan Thursday #3
akaConcernedCanuk Thursday #5
Qukid Thursday #9
akaConcernedCanuk Thursday #10
Will Morningstar Saturday #24
Fiendish Thingy-BC Thursday #6
Lowrider1984 Thursday #7
Fiendish Thingy-BC Thursday #11
Dinkydow Saturday #14
Fiendish Thingy-BC Saturday #28
Will Morningstar Saturday #17
oflguy Saturday #27
Will Morningstar Saturday #16
DoDaMan Saturday #29
Will Morningstar Saturday #31
DoDaMan Saturday #32
Deplorable Thursday #8
Will Morningstar Saturday #18
Ag Rising Thursday #12
Will Morningstar Saturday #19
Ag Rising Saturday #20
Will Morningstar Saturday #21
Ag Rising Saturday #22
Will Morningstar Saturday #23
oflguy Saturday #25
Will Morningstar Saturday #33
oflguy Saturday #34
Will Morningstar Saturday #35
oflguy Saturday #36
Will Morningstar Sunday #37
oflguy Sunday #38
Will Morningstar Sunday #39
oflguy Sunday #40
Will Morningstar Sunday #41
Magyar Heidinn Monday #43
Will Morningstar Monday #46
OneLoudVoice Sunday #42
oflguy Monday #44
Will Morningstar Monday #48
oflguy Monday #49
Will Morningstar Monday #53
oflguy Monday #54
Will Morningstar Monday #56
oflguy Monday #45
Will Morningstar Monday #47
oflguy Monday #50
Will Morningstar Monday #51
oflguy Monday #52
Will Morningstar Monday #55

Response to RCW2014 (Original post)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 02:24 AM

1. Note it uses RT sources for full Russian Agitprop effect

As to the RCAF they really are a domestic defense force and No one in NATO counts on Canada since they pulled out of FRG back in 1990.

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Response to Banshee 3 Actual (Reply #1)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 07:38 AM

4. Globe and Mail

The federal government will officially punish Boeing Co. for its trade dispute against Canada's Bombardier Inc., replacing the planned order of 18 new Boeing jets with the purchase of up to 30 second-hand fighters from the Australian military, sources said.

Government and industry sources said the Australia deal will be announced as early as next week, with the Royal Canadian Air Force needing 28 to 30 used F/A-18 fighter jets to meet its international commitments.

Read also: Boeing CEO vows to keep up fight against Bombardier

Defence Minister Harjit Sajjan has said Canada cannot meet all of its obligations to the North American Aerospace Defence Command (NORAD) and the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) with its current fleet of CF-18s, arguing new fighter jets are needed before the entire fleet is replaced in the next decade.

"We are going to fill that interim capability gap," he told reporters on Tuesday. "I look forward to making the announcement at the appropriate time."

The government's decision to buy Australian fighter jets stands to increase tensions with Boeing, which has repeatedly warned that billions of dollars in business activity in Canada are at stake in the ongoing dispute.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/federal-government-scraps-plan-to-buy-boeing-jets-turns-to-australian-military-instead/article37218857/

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Response to Banshee 3 Actual (Reply #1)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 09:40 AM

13. We originally bought 134 CF-18's.

Very happy with them. Northrop counter-offered us 350 F-5's for same price, but we needed a two-engine fighter to be survivable for the pilots in patrolling our frozen north in case of engine failure outside search-and rescue envelope. Defence Minister Barnett C. "Barney" Danson found the latter argument convincing, and chose the better aircraft. We didn't need 350 fighters, as we did not anticipate fighting the 8th Guards Division in the Ruhr Valley LOL.

Attrition has left us with 74 mission-capable, needed replacements. Our own Bristol Aerospace handles spares, maintenance and tool-and-die. Previous government was arm-twisted into provisional contract for CF-35, an inappropriate, inferior and problematic choice for our purposes in many respects. Justin cancelled that contract and bought out the penalty. Paid to refurbish and extend life of existing fleet; updated electronics.

Here's where it gets interesting: We've been very happy with Boeing and their superb product. We thought Boeing appreciated our business, our relationship, our friendship, our good-faith, and our loyalty to Boeing Aerospace too. We signed a provisional contract with Boeing to top-up our fleet with a large number of Super-Hornets, the spiffy new model, as a bridge until we could take delivery of our yet-to-be-chosen next-generation fighter-plane.

Then Boeing treacherously, dishonourably, and dishonestly stabbed Canada in the back, in a deliberate underhanded squeeze-play to destroy Canada's civilian aircraft industry, and force a major international passenger-jet competitor into bankruptcy, destroy the lives and careers of thousands of Canadians, and prevent an innovative new product WITH WHICH THEY DID NOT EVEN COMPETE, from entering the market.

Boeing filed a complaint against Bombardier with America's one-sided International Trade Commission, (even though they knew they had no case, and were certain to lose the ruling 2 years down the road), solely for the purpose of receiving their automatic 220% punitive interim duties on Bombrdier's new aircraft in the American Market.

When Armand Bombardier first invented the Ski-Doo snowmobile in his little Quebec machine-shop, never did he dream that one day Bombardier would be a world leader in aviation. Boeing saw the chance to bring that dream to an end. Bombardier took a great risk, and spent every penny they had inventing a totally new class of passenger aircraft, a total category-killer which airlines around the world were clamoring for. Boeing had NO PRODUCT and NO COMPETITION WHATSOEVER with Bombardier in this TOTALLY NEW CATEGORY. This did not matter to the U.S. "International Trade Commission". Boeing knew the rules, and played the game: Lose the case later, let's kill Bombardier now. In two years when Bombardier wins the case they'll already be dead.

Bombardier realized that if they could outsmart Boeing, there would be more sales internationally than in America anyway. But only if Bombardier could stop Boeing from killing Bombardier on a technicality right now. So Bombardier gave away their entire American business for one dollar to stay alive and outwit those dirty Boeing pricks.

Justin and Defence Minister Lt.Col. Harjit Singh Sajjan were not amused (Google "Badass Minister" to see his picture.) Justin called Boeing and said "Bite me". Two phone calls later, we're buying Australia's used fleet of F-18's. We've already got Bristol Aerospace tooled up for spares and maintenance. Boeing can kiss our hairy ass. Boeing is cut off. Boeing gets what's coming to Boeing. Boeing gets jack.

And that is the REST of the story. -30-

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #13)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 12:06 PM

26. Dear Justin

No, you bite US!

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Response to oflguy (Reply #26)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 02:15 PM

30. So you approve of Boeing's actions. Justin and your President are friends.

Canadians are your best friends. No decent American would approve of dirty underhanded Boeing's behaviour. Obviously you didn't read the thread. This is not the schoolyard. We are adults. Decent people don't behave as Boeing did. Decent Americans will thank us for calling them out. I'll bet Boeing won't try any funny business with the American Defence Department now.

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Response to RCW2014 (Original post)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 02:31 AM

2. Oh Canada, you are so cute. First of all, why does Canada need fighter jets?

In other news, Australia is buying a brand new ready to ship fleet of Super Hornets and to pay for it, they will dump their old junk on the Canadians.

Where are spare f-18 parts made and by whom I wonder.

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Response to Badsamm (Reply #2)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 09:57 AM

15. Bristol Aerospace.

Last edited Sat Dec 9, 2017, 10:36 AM - Edit history (1)

ON EDIT 10:32 a.m.: We WANTED the Super Hornet. Read the details. I did not slant or exaggerate. That's what Boeing did. And why. It's just not good business to stab your customers in the back because they "need you" and you think you can "get away with it". There's NO way to "spin" this. It is what it is.

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Response to RCW2014 (Original post)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 03:09 AM

3. Whaadafuc Canadians need those for? Attack syrup makers?

Canada is a shit hole (although still loaded with natural resources of the non-human kind) and will always be a shit hole red headed step child of the U.S. But not forever. It's looking more like Mexico with every passing day. We'll cut them off from the tit one day, you'll see.

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Response to DoDaMan (Reply #3)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 08:44 AM

5. Your comments reminds me of this . . . . . .

God Created Canada:

On the sixth day God turned to Archangel Gabriel and said: "Today I am going to create a land called Canada, it will be a land of outstanding natural beauty. It shall have tall majestic mountains full of mountain goats and eagles, beautiful sparkling lakes bountiful with bass and trout, forests full of elk and moose, high cliffs over-looking sandy beaches with an abundance of sea life, and rivers stocked with salmon."

God continued, "I shall make the land rich in oil so as to make the inhabitants prosper, I shall call these inhabitants Canadians, and they shall be known as the most friendly people on the earth."

"But Lord," asked Gabriel, "don't you think you are being too generous to these Canadians?"

"Not really," replied God, "just wait and see the neighbours I am going to give them."



CC

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Response to akaConcernedCanuk (Reply #5)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 07:44 PM

9. Yet, you choose to spend your time with us.

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Response to Qukid (Reply #9)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 07:59 PM

10. Well - even up here I have had neighbors I was not particularly fond of

but felt it wise to at least keep an eye on them . . .



CC

PS: - I should add, that during my stay of 14 months in SanDee CA, (1979-80) I found most of y'all quite friendly! - 'specially them California girls -

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Response to Qukid (Reply #9)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 10:54 AM

24. Aww, Q, You're good enuf, you're snart enuf, and gosh darn it, we like you!

Will ("Senator Frank Allen") Morningstar*

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Response to DoDaMan (Reply #3)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 10:35 AM

6. Not bad for a shit hole

Canadians live longer, have a lower infant mortality rate, lower per capita murder rate (by a factor of 3) , and consistently rate themselves as happier than Americans do, all while accepting more immigrants and refugees per capita than America.

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Response to Fiendish Thingy-BC (Reply #6)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 06:37 PM

7. That may be true, but

Canada is too damned cold to be infested with inner-city Africans killing each other and others.
I am certain that affects the murder rate stats.
Oh, and those immigrants and refugees that you are bragging about?
They're going to bite you in the ass, just wait and see.

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Response to Lowrider1984 (Reply #7)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 09:19 PM

11. You realize Detroit is just across the border from Canada?

And BC winters are pretty mild. So much for your temperature-based murder rate theory.

Canada has been a haven for multicultural immigration for decades, to no significant ill effect.

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Response to Fiendish Thingy-BC (Reply #11)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 09:48 AM

14. Detroit is north of Canada

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Response to Dinkydow (Reply #14)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 12:23 PM

28. Exactly- thus refuting the temperature-based theory of murder rates nt

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Response to Lowrider1984 (Reply #7)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 10:00 AM

17. Then you can read about us in National Geographic if it serves your Confirmation Bias.

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Response to Fiendish Thingy-BC (Reply #6)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 12:09 PM

27. Keep taking in those Muslims

Because you need to learn the hard way.

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Response to DoDaMan (Reply #3)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 09:57 AM

16. Noted.

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #16)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 02:02 PM

29. Oh Yey! DoDaMan got a "star" by his name

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Response to DoDaMan (Reply #29)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 02:17 PM

31. Cool*

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #31)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 02:23 PM

32. .....



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Response to RCW2014 (Original post)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 07:16 PM

8. They need the money for muslim refugee housing.

Luckily for the snow mexicans, they have us to protect them.

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Response to Deplorable (Reply #8)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 10:03 AM

18. Our Muslims are highly educated and have proved to be no drain.

Many are also privately sponsored at a minimum $23.000/head. No drain. Happy to have them.

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Response to RCW2014 (Original post)

Thu Dec 7, 2017, 10:18 PM

12. We should drop the nuclear umbrella

Let the fat kid with the bad haircut have at them.

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Response to Ag Rising (Reply #12)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 10:05 AM

19. We are your first line of defence against haircut guy.

It's called "North American" Air Defence (NORAD) for a reason.

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #19)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 10:19 AM

20. Missile defense systems belonging to the United States

Are the first line of defense.

For all intents and purposes the US is NORAD.

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Response to Ag Rising (Reply #20)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 10:25 AM

21. NORAD is the successor to the Distant Early Warning Line (DEW Line). Built by us. On our turf.

HQ Cheyenne Mountain, Colorado. NORAD Command alternates between Canadian and American ranking officer.

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #21)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 10:29 AM

22. We developed and built the hardware and technology

We're simply letting America Lite play in our sandbox because it benefits us.

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Response to Ag Rising (Reply #22)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 10:40 AM

23. Of course. I'm happy you realize it benefits you.

Besides, Canada provides a place for your poets to flee to.

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Response to RCW2014 (Original post)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 12:01 PM

25. America first!

Good going Trump

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Response to oflguy (Reply #25)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 02:25 PM

33. Boeing doesn't SELL a plane that competes with Bombardier's products.

Your "America first" slogan is meaningless. Boeing hurt Bombardier just to be a bitch.

Boeing got called out and bitchslapped.

And Canada IS ALREADY the AMERICA FIRST TRADING PARTNER.

You already HAVE your wish.

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #33)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 08:42 PM

34. Wrong

The US has a trade deficit with Canada, as is the case throughout the world

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Response to oflguy (Reply #34)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 09:53 PM

35. That's not what "trade deficit" means.

Us two have fair and balaned trade. Canadians are not closiing factories in your country. When YOU decide to buy more from us than YOU decide to sell to us, that's a so-called "trade deficit" That's NOTHING to do with BOEING stopping us from selling something in the States that Boeing doesn't make. Doesn't mean ten cents to Boeing, your "trade deficit" or your golf score. In fact, it has exactly as much to do with Boeing's sales, golf score and trade deficit. Meaning nothing at all.

Backstabbing won't make anybody great at anything.

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #35)

Sat Dec 9, 2017, 09:55 PM

36. Get a decent president, or whatever you call that jackass

Until then, Canada is a shithole

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Response to oflguy (Reply #36)

Sun Dec 10, 2017, 09:09 AM

37. This has nothing to do with "the greatest President in modern history"

as you describe your president. Or my "Indecent Shit-Hole", as you describe me and mine. We were talking about issues, not the "shit" in my "hole". Use your potty-mouth for a more constructive purpose than personal attacks and disrespect of the Discussionist™ Terms of Service.

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #37)

Sun Dec 10, 2017, 09:15 AM

38. You and your shit-hole country deserve everything that happens to you

Your other Canadian posters in this forum are some of the most obnoxious pieces of humanity that walk the face of the earth. Importing Muslims will prove to be a big mistake, and I have no sympathy for whatever American companies do to Canada. You voted for him. Live with the consequences.

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Response to oflguy (Reply #38)

Sun Dec 10, 2017, 09:37 AM

39. Please stop ToS Violation "oflguy", you are abusing "Will Morningstar".

PUBLIC NOTICE: PLEASE DO NOT ALERT THIS PERSONAL ATTACK. The victim will only be blamed.

Do not alert. Fingers off the button, please. That's what this ToS Violator wants: to make a spectacle of his victim for his own sick enjoyment in calling me and mine a "Shit-Hole" and getting away with it. So let him.

Abuse me, "oflguy", I am defenceless.

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #39)

Sun Dec 10, 2017, 09:47 AM

40. Truth hurts, I see

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Response to oflguy (Reply #40)

Sun Dec 10, 2017, 01:22 PM

41. No probs, oflguy. Understand your need to support your man. No prob at all with that.

It just was un-necessary. This was private company shit-fest, nothing to do with your good U.S. Govt. Follow banshee3actual. Your man. Good man. Knows what's going on. Did it for a living. This is a private company issue. Not a lefty/righty issue. Not a U.S./Canada issue. Not a "trade deficit" issue.

Say it again: Got no probs with you. Support your man. We wish him well. He IS your President. Hope he succeeds. You are our neighbors, after all. It's good to have good neighbors.

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Response to oflguy (Reply #38)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 12:36 AM

43. Bad faith alert.

Can we get a “this is why we can’t have nice things” whine!

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Response to Magyar Heidinn (Reply #43)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 09:21 AM

46. Thank you, my friend. Specifically requested poster NOT be alerted on.

Note end of thread. Explained his error; we kissed and made up. No Twinkies here.

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Response to RCW2014 (Original post)

Sun Dec 10, 2017, 09:06 PM

42. China takes our jobs,

India sends us all the high tech workers that our ceo's could want in their efforts to avoid paying workers, and Trump cracks down on Canada.

Par for the incompetent course.

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Response to RCW2014 (Original post)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 08:44 AM

44. China does the same thing

The government subsidizes a product and they sell them to the United States, undercutting American manufacturing jobs, costing American families their livelihood.

Finally, we have a president willing to stand up against these devious practices that gives foreign countries an unfair advantage over our workers.

Making America competitive again.

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Response to oflguy (Reply #44)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 09:57 AM

48. CHINA has a $44 BILLION DOLLAR TRADE DEFICIT WITH CANADA

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #48)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 02:23 PM

49. Do you have a point?

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Response to oflguy (Reply #49)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 04:37 PM

53. Go bother China, and quit hurting your friends who don't deserve it.

And stop being insulting. Don't be a pill, and
be spoiling other people's enjoyment of this site. No "widdle fee-fees" here. Sorry, you're not hurting me at all. This is an internet website. I have a right to be here, and nothing you can do to stop me. So suck it up.

Go troll someone who cares.

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #53)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 04:41 PM

54. Your fellow Canadian posters don't consider the US "friends"

Canada has no chat forums?

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Response to oflguy (Reply #54)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 04:44 PM

56. Don't blame me for other guys. What state are you from?

And, no we don't. Only one Internet. This is it.

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Response to RCW2014 (Original post)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 08:50 AM

45. Damn straight

"The Premier of Canada's Quebec Province Philippe Couillard has blasted Boeing, accusing the company of unfairly trying to destroy Bombardier. "

You go, Trump. If Canada is going to subsidize their manufacturers, make it fair by tagging a Tariff on their products.

THEN lets see how willing Canada is to fuck over American manufacturing jobs by artificially lowering their product's prices.

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Response to oflguy (Reply #45)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 09:54 AM

47. No "subsidies" because Boeing had NO PRODUCT repeat NO PRODUCT repeat NO PRODUCT.

1) Boeing and Bombardier were NOT COMPETITORS repeat NOT COMPETITORS repeat NOT COMPETITORS.

2) To have "unfair subsidies" you must (1) HAVE A PRODUCT repeat HAVE A PRODUCT repeat HAVE A PRODUCT whose sales are harmed by the unfair competition, and (2) PROVE INJURY repeat PROVE INJURY repeat PROVE INJURY to your EXISTING PRODUCT repeat EXISTING PRODUCT repeat EXISTING PRODUCT.

3) It is IMPOSSIBLE repeat IMPOSSIBLE repeat IMPOSSIBLE to PROVE INJURY repeat PROVE INJURY repeat PROVE INJURY when you have NO PRODUCT repeat NO PRODUCT repeat NO PRODUCT.

4) Let me SPELL THIS OUT repeat SPELL THIS OUT repeat SPELL THIS OUT FOR YOU:

5) OFLGUY & Co.Ltd. makes LAWNMOWERS.

6) MORNINGSTAR & Co.Ltd. makes CHAINSAWS.

7) OFLGUY brand LAWNMOWERS do not compete with MORNINGSTAR brand CHAINSAWS

8) MORNINGSTAR & Co.Ltd. DOES NOT MAKE lawnmowers. Morningstar & Co.Ltd. MAKES CHAINSAWS.

9) OFLGUY IS INNOCENT because LAWNMOWERS DO NOT COMPETE WITH CHAINSAWS.

10) BOEING makes CHAINSAWS.

11) BOMBARDIER makes LAWNMOWERS.

12) Lawnmowers DO NOT COMPETE with Chainsaws.

13) CHAINSAWS do not compete WITH LAWNMOWERS.

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #47)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 02:37 PM

50. Calm down

Don't you have some Canadians to annoy?

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Response to oflguy (Reply #50)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 04:25 PM

51. "Don't bait me. Don't troll me. Don't stalk me. Don't act like an ass". Is uncivil, against rules.

1) And now you want to get in my face and gloat.
2) Nothing happened to you when you called me a "shit hole", over and over.
3) You got this thread trashed so my friends can't read it, and now you want to chase me around and laugh in my face.
4) What's wrong with you? Abusing people get you off?
5) And no, you're not bothering me. Go ahead, get yourself FFRed like the last guy who tried this on me. I just let him do it, until everybody had enough.

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Response to Will Morningstar (Reply #51)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 04:31 PM

52. I guess the answer is no

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Response to oflguy (Reply #52)

Mon Dec 11, 2017, 04:41 PM

55. Right you are.

And don't get me wrong. I've read your posts, you're solid, you're not a bad guy. You just have a malfunction in your targeting system.
We're your #1 friends. Don't mess us up, no point to it.

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