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Sun Jan 28, 2018, 01:57 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

How to create a Republicanist tax cut. Suppose I spend $100 per month to pay my bills...

Taxes are just bills. Like all bills, they are paid with owned money. Like all bills, taxes should be recognized as obligations that must be met by anyone under those obligations. Part of that $100, say $10, goes to taxes. Pay it. The democratic Republic you are a part of said so. Whine if you must, but pay the $10.

To many Republicanists, the $10 should be classified as "hard-earned money." That is, it's just $10 they own that came to them as income, but they want people to think they toiled in a salt mine for it. That way it makes their argument more melodramatic, albeit without affecting its validity.

Now, let's create a Republicanist tax cut and give the poor salt miners "back" $1 of their bill. We're going to make their bill $9. They are going to roll around on the floor with their hands and feet in the air shouting our praises when we do that.

Simple. The government logs in to the online bank account of every single salt miner. Once there, they do a cash advance transfer of $1 from the miner's credit card to the government's pocket. Then, they send the miner a tax bill for $9. The miners are ecstatic. The government gets the credit.

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Arrow 69 replies Author Time Post
Reply How to create a Republicanist tax cut. Suppose I spend $100 per month to pay my bills... (Original post)
 swifty Jan 2018 OP
LineReply Democrats have been doing this since the 1930s bro.
 Killdozer Jan 2018 #1
LineReply If you want to pay more in taxes
 bruiserboy Jan 2018 #2
LineReply You are more than welcome
 Tolk Jan 2018 #3
LineReply "..taxes should be recognized as obligations that must be met by ANYONE under those obligations.."
 Oldgeezer Jan 2018 #4
LineLineReply It's all just law to the law abiding.
 swifty Jan 2018 #5
LineLineLineReply So if we pass a law that swifty and seifty only must pay 99% of its income that is OK with you
 freedumb2003 Jan 2018 #7
LineLineLineLineReply Your "taxes are theft" quarreling only make sense at the extremes.
 swifty Jan 2018 #11
LineLineLineLineLineReply then define 'extreme'... like, with an actual percentage number
 MumblyPeg Jan 2018 #24
LineLineLineLineLineLineReply Maybe two sigma
 swifty Jan 2018 #31
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply Then explain this.
 Carl Jan 2018 #49
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineNew Reply thats not a defined number. what percentage do you insist people pay?
 MumblyPeg Jan 2018 #61
LineLineLineLineLineReply Logic doesn't work that way as "extreme" has no absolute definition
 freedumb2003 Jan 2018 #30
LineLineLineLineLineLineReply Nope, because the value of money changes at different times and income levels.
 swifty Jan 2018 #35
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply "slothfulness problem"
 freedumb2003 Jan 2018 #39
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply I thought it was 47%...ya know, an "exact" figure (supposedly)
 swifty Jan 2018 #45
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineNew Reply Your definition of sloth and mine differ
 freedumb2003 Jan 2018 #60
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply That's what you assume
 Currentsitguy Jan 2018 #48
LineLineLineLineLineReply In the context of the real world
 kevlar Jan 2018 #59
LineLineLineReply I'm starting to think you are related to moneyshot....closely.
 Oldgeezer Jan 2018 #15
LineLineLineLineReply State support of higher education has dropped dramatically...
 swifty Jan 2018 #19
LineLineLineLineLineReply The cost of university tuition has skyrocketed thanks to Democrats
 bfox74 Jan 2018 #25
LineLineLineLineLineReply this is some of the dumbest shit I've ever seen.
 MumblyPeg Jan 2018 #27
LineLineLineLineLineReply STATE suppport....ok goal post officially moved to the far left. Got it.
 Oldgeezer Jan 2018 #29
LineLineLineLineLineReply Suggesting that college is a proper post-HS path is part of the problem
 freedumb2003 Jan 2018 #32
LineLineLineLineLineLineNew Reply That is a truth that is worth repeating...
 LaughingGull Jan 2018 #64
LineReply Why should those who owed and paid $0 income taxes get a refund check??
 quad489 Jan 2018 #6
LineLineReply This message was self-deleted by its author
 CoveredBridge Jan 2018 #43
LineReply This is also law, Feel free to show the way and contribute
 Banshee 3 Actual Jan 2018 #8
LineReply The democratic Republic you are a part of elected Trump President.
 Nostrings Jan 2018 #9
LineLineReply Touche...but the anti-Trump arguments aren't mere money.
 swifty Jan 2018 #12
LineReply It takes a really simple mind to think the government is your biggest priority.
 DDKick Jan 2018 #10
LineLineReply Citizens deserve their owned money and a good country.
 swifty Jan 2018 #14
LineLineLineReply "..dramatically increasing the taxes of future taxpayers"...that's just bullshit and I KNOW
 Oldgeezer Jan 2018 #17
LineLineLineNew Reply What a steaming pile of uniformed crap.
 Cave Dweller Jan 2018 #67
LineReply Behold the great Lefty trying to spin his way out of the tax cut benefits
 Da Mannn Jan 2018 #13
LineLineReply To be clear...not "everyone". MOST employees will...me in The Peoples Republic of NY and an
 Oldgeezer Jan 2018 #20
LineLineLineReply This message was self-deleted by its author
 CoveredBridge Jan 2018 #47
LineLineLineLineReply Don't get me started on that pile of crap....
 Oldgeezer Jan 2018 #52
LineReply Does your mother know you're posting online
 Bob the Bilderberger Jan 2018 #16
LineReply Obviously you see people as subjects, not citizens.
 Charlie Mike Jan 2018 #18
LineReply Please keep embarrasing yourself swift.
 Carl Jan 2018 #21
LineLineReply I can't believe you don't see that link as a joke.
 swifty Jan 2018 #22
LineLineLineReply Bull shit.
 Carl Jan 2018 #46
LineLineReply Oh my.
 Charlie Mike Jan 2018 #54
LineReply no one owuld have any problems paying the required taxes
 MumblyPeg Jan 2018 #23
LineLineReply I despise Marxists but am Ok with some forms of "redistribution."
 swifty Jan 2018 #26
LineLineLineReply then you are a socialist. and I find that repulsive.
 MumblyPeg Jan 2018 #28
LineLineLineLineReply It's just a label. We're all socialists.
 swifty Jan 2018 #33
LineLineLineLineLineReply How can you say such things publicly? Seriously.
 Nostrings Jan 2018 #36
LineLineLineLineLineLineReply It's just labels, as I say.
 swifty Jan 2018 #40
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply You confuse socialist with voluntary collectivist.
 Nostrings Jan 2018 #50
LineLineLineLineLineReply "Charity is Socialist".
 Muddling Through Jan 2018 #37
LineLineLineLineLineReply "Charity is socialist. Inviting your neighbor to a potluck is socialist."
 freedumb2003 Jan 2018 #41
LineLineLineLineLineLineReply "Socialism is redistribution at the point of a gun and the decision of others."
 Carl Jan 2018 #53
LineLineLineLineLineNew Reply nice try, gulliver, but charity is the exact opposite of your beloved socialism
 MumblyPeg Jan 2018 #62
LineLineLineReply How about sons of Billionaire Blacks getting affirmative action? OK, you say that's more
 Dumper Jan 2018 #34
LineLineLineLineReply I'm against PC but for smart investment in all categories
 swifty Jan 2018 #38
LineLineLineLineLineReply This message was self-deleted by its author
 CoveredBridge Jan 2018 #51
LineLineLineNew Reply Nothing wrong with redistribution
 Valishin Jan 2018 #68
LineReply I would love to pay $10 out of a hundred Ive earned. The biggest problem
 Paradigm Jan 2018 #42
LineLineReply No offense, but you guys shouldn't be letting Republicanists define fairness using calculator math.
 swifty Jan 2018 #44
LineLineLineReply What is your definition of fairness?
 Charlie Mike Jan 2018 #55
LineLineLineLineNew Reply It can be summed up by one word.
 Carl Jan 2018 #65
LineLineLineLineLineNew Reply That is the impression they tend to leave but they rush in to deny that is the case.
 Charlie Mike Jan 2018 #66
LineLineLineReply Fairness between one and ones government dictates all being treated equally.
 Nostrings Jan 2018 #56
LineLineLineReply You keep mining the bottom for stupid posts.
 Carl Jan 2018 #58
LineLineLineNew Reply Actually fair taxation
 Valishin Jan 2018 #69
LineReply This is how your mind works?
 oflguy Jan 2018 #57
LineNew Reply ******************SILLY RABBIT AWARD**********************
 rahtruelies Jan 2018 #63

Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 01:59 PM

Killdozer (1,846 posts)

1. Democrats have been doing this since the 1930s bro.

 

Talk to us about Obama's NINE TRILLION in charges.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 01:59 PM

bruiserboy (10,066 posts)

2. If you want to pay more in taxes

Be my guest.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:00 PM

Tolk (11,388 posts)

3. You are more than welcome

 

To send all your money to the government and they will gladly give back what they decide you need.
That is what you are promoting.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:06 PM

Oldgeezer (6,708 posts)

4. "..taxes should be recognized as obligations that must be met by ANYONE under those obligations.."

Yet about +47 % pay ZERO federal income taxes.....and because of refundable credits, many of those get money back with a zero Fed Tax liability.

You have written some convoluted economic stuff before.. but this ranks up there with much of moneyshot's drivel.

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Response to Oldgeezer (Reply #4)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:15 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

5. It's all just law to the law abiding.

That 47% who don't pay federal income taxes includes people like students, low-income folks, retired folks, and the wealthy who game the system. It's just just a "soap opera drama" number designed to excite people who are easily excited in conversations about taxes.

We are spending tons of money on for-profit prisons where people who would normally be paying taxes, Social Security, etc., are being locked up for stupid reasons. We are spending tons of money on weapon systems that won't be used (although that is fine with me because I just consider it stimulus).

We are rationing education. People who get educated raise their incomes and pay a ton more taxes. Thanks to Republicanists, we are deliberately keeping people from becoming higher income earners, causing everyone's taxes to be higher than necessary.

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Response to swifty (Reply #5)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:18 PM

freedumb2003 (5,878 posts)

7. So if we pass a law that swifty and seifty only must pay 99% of its income that is OK with you

 

I mean, it is legal which is your major criterion.

(I await more of your addled rantings as to what taxation is and how it should be accomplished).

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Response to freedumb2003 (Reply #7)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:28 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

11. Your "taxes are theft" quarreling only make sense at the extremes.

Of course I would be against having to be the only one who pays 99% of my income to taxes. That never happens. In my posts I always assume that my comments are taken to be in the context of the real world as it exists today. I might say, the "weather in Minneapolis is going to be nice today," for example. I assume people aren't going to say, "Yeah, but what if an asteroid hits the Earth or Minneapolis is targeted by a mad scientist with a bad weather ray."

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Response to swifty (Reply #11)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:49 PM

MumblyPeg (20,417 posts)

24. then define 'extreme'... like, with an actual percentage number

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Response to MumblyPeg (Reply #24)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:58 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

31. Maybe two sigma

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/68–95–99.7_rule

As a suggestion. 95% of the people who are taxed should not experience a noticeably excessive burden or benefit.

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Response to swifty (Reply #31)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:41 PM

Carl (22,279 posts)

49. Then explain this.

https://taxfoundation.org/summary-latest-federal-income-tax-data-2015-update/

In 2012, the top 50 percent of all taxpayers (69.2 million filers) paid 97.2 percent of all income taxes while the bottom 50 percent paid the remaining 2.8 percent.

The top 1 percent (1.3 million filers) paid a greater share of income taxes (37.8 percent) than the bottom 90 percent (124.5 million filers) combined (30.2 percent).

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Response to swifty (Reply #31)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 06:03 PM

MumblyPeg (20,417 posts)

61. thats not a defined number. what percentage do you insist people pay?

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Response to swifty (Reply #11)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:57 PM

freedumb2003 (5,878 posts)

30. Logic doesn't work that way as "extreme" has no absolute definition

 

I would say California has gone BEYOND the extreme in its taxation policy.

The use of "argumendo ad absurdum" notes that your attempt to argue has no logical basis. Taxing millionaires just because they dared to succeed is just as absurd as taxing you at 99%. EQUALLY.

I would say that an even percent (say 8 to 12) for everyone -- at the Federal level only -- no state or local taxes is the ONLY taxation system that is both fair and NOT absurd.

Anything else rewards sloth (or bad life decisions) and punishes industriousness.

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Response to freedumb2003 (Reply #30)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:10 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

35. Nope, because the value of money changes at different times and income levels.

Money is just an exchange method for one form valuation, but true valuation reaches deep into psychology and the human experience. If you only have $100 to your name, $10 is a lot of money. If you have $100B, $90B isn't as much as the $10 was to the $100 person. That's why we have these extremely rich people giving away the bulk of their fortunes.

Money doesn't mean as much to you once you reach really old age also.

And, no, I'm not saying "tax the old," so save the typing. I'm saying that we can maximize wealth for the deserving by not using a straight line algorithm (flat tax or other such simplistic approach).

You guys are really hung up on rewarding sloth and so forth, but we never really hear of any concrete examples of this huge slothfulness problem.

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Response to swifty (Reply #35)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:20 PM

freedumb2003 (5,878 posts)

39. "slothfulness problem"

 

45% of working Americans pay no taxes = sloth and encouraging/rewarding

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Response to freedumb2003 (Reply #39)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:32 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

45. I thought it was 47%...ya know, an "exact" figure (supposedly)

And the 47% included people too poor to pay taxes, rich enough to use loopholes not to pay taxes, going to school, retired, and disabled. None of those are sloth.

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Response to swifty (Reply #45)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 04:06 PM

freedumb2003 (5,878 posts)

60. Your definition of sloth and mine differ

 

significantly.

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Response to swifty (Reply #35)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:35 PM

Currentsitguy (20,995 posts)

48. That's what you assume

Let me use the McDonalds example for you. I would stop occasionally when the had the $1 menu. I consider anything more than $1 too much to pay for a fast food sandwich. It didn't matter if I had $200 or $20000 in the bank. I simply will not pay more. When they eliminated it I stopped going. Apparently a significant number of people agree, since they just brought it back.

The point is it is not a matter of how much is a lot of money. It's a matter of what value do I get for the money. In terms of the tax system everyone should have some skin in the game, and not segment of the population should be expected on a percentage basis to shoulder more of the burden. I'll pick an arbitrary number for the sake of discussion, but say 18% is a fair burden. If that is the case I don't care you you make $20000 a year or $20000000, your burden should be just that, 18%.

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Response to swifty (Reply #11)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:56 PM

kevlar (14,350 posts)

59. In the context of the real world

the tax laws have been changed, your argument is about how it was yesterday.

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Response to swifty (Reply #5)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:35 PM

Oldgeezer (6,708 posts)

15. I'm starting to think you are related to moneyshot....closely.

"We are rationing education." Example 1 of a close relationship to my old bud moneystupid(shot)...

How exactly are we "rationing education"...are we kicking kids out of pre-k, bootin' them from middle school, denying them Jr./Sr. high school........what's the "rationing" you speak of. I suspect this is going to well sourced by the likes of Vox, Media Matters, Correct the Record, Bernie, some teachers union "study"......please show the "rationing"

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Response to Oldgeezer (Reply #15)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:40 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

19. State support of higher education has dropped dramatically...

...thanks to Republicanists. It is now much, much more expensive to go to a university or community college. There needs to be free college available to all, not just to the young but to any age. I'm perfectly fine with private education also, but as citizens, we can't afford to put college education out of reach to the qualified.

On edit: I recall "moneyshot," but I'm not that person if that is what you are wondering.

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Response to swifty (Reply #19)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:53 PM

bfox74 (14,706 posts)

25. The cost of university tuition has skyrocketed thanks to Democrats

The fed continues to subsidize it so the price keeps increasing to outpace the subsidies.

General rule of econ, what you subsidize you get more of. What you tax you get less of. The more you subsidize tuition the higher it will go.

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Response to swifty (Reply #19)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:53 PM

MumblyPeg (20,417 posts)

27. this is some of the dumbest shit I've ever seen.

College is expensive in large part because of nearly unlimited access to taxpayer subsidized loans. Universities can ask nearly any price they want, pay union employees outrageous salaries, and admit dumb people based on sex or race identity. ALL those things are the handy work of socialists who have either zero understanding of finance and economy, or they do and have to hide it in order to progress their completely unsustainable models.

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Response to swifty (Reply #19)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:56 PM

Oldgeezer (6,708 posts)

29. STATE suppport....ok goal post officially moved to the far left. Got it.

You have now evidenced you have ZERO clue on the financing stream for post public school education.
The costs of student loans blew up when those federal loans were rolled into the Obamacare bill...just like medical costs.

"There needs to be free college available to all,..." who pays the professors wages....the cafeteria staff, the nursing staff, the janitors, the grounds keepers? How do you pay that multi million dollar freight for those learning institutions....a 90% tax rate on those that ACTUALLY pay taxes?

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Response to swifty (Reply #19)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:00 PM

freedumb2003 (5,878 posts)

32. Suggesting that college is a proper post-HS path is part of the problem

 

There should be a 2-track system that makes the trades as important as college. In all ways. College today RUINS people a lot more than gets them ready for a work life.

And by your reasoning there should also be free housing, free transportation, free food, free health care, and free vacations for everyone. I mean if college should be free then so should everything else.

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Response to freedumb2003 (Reply #32)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 09:30 PM

LaughingGull (9,076 posts)

64. That is a truth that is worth repeating...

"There should be a 2-track system that makes the trades as important as college. In all ways. College today RUINS people a lot more than gets them ready for a work life."


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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:17 PM

quad489 (24,187 posts)

6. Why should those who owed and paid $0 income taxes get a refund check??

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Response to quad489 (Reply #6)

CoveredBridge This message was self-deleted by its author.

Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:19 PM

Banshee 3 Actual (49,152 posts)

8. This is also law, Feel free to show the way and contribute

https://www.pay.gov/public/form/start/23779454

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:20 PM

Nostrings (23,960 posts)

9. The democratic Republic you are a part of elected Trump President.

Whine if you must, but...

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Response to Nostrings (Reply #9)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:29 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

12. Touche...but the anti-Trump arguments aren't mere money.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:24 PM

DDKick (8,261 posts)

10. It takes a really simple mind to think the government is your biggest priority.

The government serves the tax payer not the other way around. This is the root problem with the really mentally challenged people alive today.

America was formed in the beginning with 0 taxes wasn't it? It grew on basically sales tax not income. The left can't understand that people who earn the money deserve it.

I would support a 90% income tax on people who have come out against tax cuts would you ?

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Response to DDKick (Reply #10)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:35 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

14. Citizens deserve their owned money and a good country.

Republicanists don't balance the two. The Republicanist sacrifices the future to the present. Right now, the Republicanists in government are dramatically increasing the taxes of future taxpayers, giving away to corporations free garbage disposal rights into the atmosphere and rivers, and picking winners in the energy and other sectors. Their own "instincts" (I'll call them) have been subverted against them.

The government serves the citizen, not the taxpayer. It's a huge difference.

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Response to swifty (Reply #14)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:37 PM

Oldgeezer (6,708 posts)

17. "..dramatically increasing the taxes of future taxpayers"...that's just bullshit and I KNOW

You can't source it.

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Response to swifty (Reply #14)

Mon Jan 29, 2018, 10:04 AM

Cave Dweller (4,471 posts)

67. What a steaming pile of uniformed crap.

The deficit continued to rise when the tax rates were higher, They can only increase for 1 reason. Spending exceeds revenue. Until congress gets a zipper on the wallet, and the citizens come to the realization that "bringing home the bacon" is a bad thing, this country will continue to be in a financial mess.

Every time there is a tax increase, there is never a hold on spending, it always goes up. Both parties are to blame. There is no law requiring a balanced budget like many states have, and banks just keep lending the government money, there is no reason to stop spending. But, with the economy heating up, inflation is going to start to present it self. When that happens the low interest the the government is paying now on its IOU's will go up and we will all start to see the true extent of the debt.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:31 PM

Da Mannn (26,070 posts)

13. Behold the great Lefty trying to spin his way out of the tax cut benefits

Every American is going to take home a lot more this year, and they will remember in 2018.

Lefty wants to take that money away, and can't afford to run on a tax raising plan in 2018 or 220.

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Response to Da Mannn (Reply #13)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:43 PM

Oldgeezer (6,708 posts)

20. To be clear...not "everyone". MOST employees will...me in The Peoples Republic of NY and an

employer...I may take a bit of a hit because of the SALT reductions. I'm good with that though because it's a club to use against Albany....lower our frigging taxes.
Edit to add...won't be a federal hit...it'll be a state hit.

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Response to Oldgeezer (Reply #20)

CoveredBridge This message was self-deleted by its author.

Response to CoveredBridge (Reply #47)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:43 PM

Oldgeezer (6,708 posts)

52. Don't get me started on that pile of crap....

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:36 PM

Bob the Bilderberger (4,947 posts)

16. Does your mother know you're posting online

to an adult-oriented web site?

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:38 PM

Charlie Mike (18,749 posts)

18. Obviously you see people as subjects, not citizens.

sic semper tyrannis

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:43 PM

Carl (22,279 posts)

21. Please keep embarrasing yourself swift.

For good measure this is for those that still have any question about the OPs "knowledge" of issues.

https://www.discussionist.com/10151277440

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Response to Carl (Reply #21)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:46 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

22. I can't believe you don't see that link as a joke.

And it's actually a good joke, imo. I wouldn't have posted it as an OP if I didn't think so.

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Response to swifty (Reply #22)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:32 PM

Carl (22,279 posts)

46. Bull shit.

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Response to Carl (Reply #21)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:47 PM

Charlie Mike (18,749 posts)

54. Oh my.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:46 PM

MumblyPeg (20,417 posts)

23. no one owuld have any problems paying the required taxes

if socialists and communists who keep infiltrating government would stop spending it on shit that they weren't constitutionally bound to and restricted to.
It is you obsessive desire to take from one and redistribute to another by force that we take issue with, and you know it damn well.

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Response to MumblyPeg (Reply #23)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:53 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

26. I despise Marxists but am Ok with some forms of "redistribution."

There's "compassionate" redistribution. People who can't fend for themselves get food, shelter, and clothing.

There's "investment" redistribution. Paying for the higher education of a poor kid instead of paying for them to spend time in a Republicanist for-profit prison is an example. The kid's going to need good schooling, adequate nutrition, exercise, and education. Once through that path, the kid will be a high income earner and will through taxes alone pay back the investment.

Then infrastructure. You guys like to let our infrastructure go to pot. It's just another form of investment.

There is also government subsidy in burgeoning technologies that you guys like to cheap out on.

And on and on...the cheapo spends more for everything in the end.

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Response to swifty (Reply #26)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 02:55 PM

MumblyPeg (20,417 posts)

28. then you are a socialist. and I find that repulsive.

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Response to MumblyPeg (Reply #28)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:00 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

33. It's just a label. We're all socialists.

Charity is socialist. Inviting your neighbor to a potluck is socialist.

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Response to swifty (Reply #33)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:13 PM

Nostrings (23,960 posts)

36. How can you say such things publicly? Seriously.

Are you really unaware of the presence of zero government in your examples?

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Response to Nostrings (Reply #36)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:20 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

40. It's just labels, as I say.

Your neighborhood watch group deciding to send a fruit basket to a recent widow is socialist in impulse. A democratically elected government deciding to do the same isn't more socialist in impulse. You guys like to categorize things so much that you can't see past the labels.

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Response to swifty (Reply #40)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:42 PM

Nostrings (23,960 posts)

50. You confuse socialist with voluntary collectivist.

"A democratically elected government deciding to do the same isn't more socialist in impulse. "

No, its more socialist in GOVERNMENT.

Words have meanings and definitions for reason.

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Response to swifty (Reply #33)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:15 PM

Muddling Through (17,995 posts)

37. "Charity is Socialist".

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Response to swifty (Reply #33)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:21 PM

freedumb2003 (5,878 posts)

41. "Charity is socialist. Inviting your neighbor to a potluck is socialist."

 

Dumbest statement ever uttered

Charity and sharing are decided by the individual

Socialism is redistribution at the point of a gun and the decision of others.

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Response to freedumb2003 (Reply #41)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:45 PM

Carl (22,279 posts)

53. "Socialism is redistribution at the point of a gun and the decision of others."

And those others never bear any of the sacrifice.

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Response to swifty (Reply #33)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 06:05 PM

MumblyPeg (20,417 posts)

62. nice try, gulliver, but charity is the exact opposite of your beloved socialism

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Response to swifty (Reply #26)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:01 PM

Dumper (14,913 posts)

34. How about sons of Billionaire Blacks getting affirmative action? OK, you say that's more

like White Power? Thus it's not race power, but the power of the 'monied?' Then why include poor white males as victims of affirmative action?

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Response to Dumper (Reply #34)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:17 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

38. I'm against PC but for smart investment in all categories

Affirmative action is an extremely difficult topic for another OP. A main point is that if the government could see that the poor, regardless of category, had food, shelter, clothing, and health care, we would have a lot less to worry about when it comes to affirmative action. People need a certain level of investment of resources to succeed, and we need them all to succeed as much as possible. That way they pay taxes and our Social Security instead of going to prison.

We have a less-than-two birth rate right now in this country. We don't have anyone to waste.

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Response to swifty (Reply #38)

CoveredBridge This message was self-deleted by its author.

Response to swifty (Reply #26)

Mon Jan 29, 2018, 11:12 AM

Valishin (9,782 posts)

68. Nothing wrong with redistribution

so long as it is purely voluntary.

Also people wouldn't be more keen on the infrastructure stuff if the left would stop trying to relabel stuff to get it to fall under the guise of infrastructure and stop spending on all the other stuff and focus on infrastructure.

It is not the role of government to subsidize technologies burgeoning or otherwise.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:24 PM

Paradigm (6,849 posts)

42. I would love to pay $10 out of a hundred Ive earned. The biggest problem

with your post is that I payed $30 out of my $100 so almost 50% of those that choose not to work for a living paid $0.
If everyone paid 10% that would be excellent, and fair.

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Response to Paradigm (Reply #42)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:30 PM

swifty (8,204 posts)

44. No offense, but you guys shouldn't be letting Republicanists define fairness using calculator math.

It's just a scam. Fair taxation isn't straight line or easy. It's trying to figure out what settings work on the complex machine called capitalism, and that machine doesn't just have brakes and accelerator.

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Response to swifty (Reply #44)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:49 PM

Charlie Mike (18,749 posts)

55. What is your definition of fairness?

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Response to Charlie Mike (Reply #55)

Mon Jan 29, 2018, 06:25 AM

Carl (22,279 posts)

65. It can be summed up by one word.

"Gimme"

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Response to Carl (Reply #65)

Mon Jan 29, 2018, 06:31 AM

Charlie Mike (18,749 posts)

66. That is the impression they tend to leave but they rush in to deny that is the case.

Hence, my request for their own definition.

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Response to swifty (Reply #44)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:49 PM

Nostrings (23,960 posts)

56. Fairness between one and ones government dictates all being treated equally.

That means the government takes exactly the same amount from everyone.

" Fair taxation isn't straight line or easy. "

To the contrary, fair taxation IS strait line single percentage across the board taxing, where everyone is treated the same.

The courts said esssentially that in the gay marriage ruling.

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Response to swifty (Reply #44)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:52 PM

Carl (22,279 posts)

58. You keep mining the bottom for stupid posts.

In that garbled jumble of words is the notion that taxation fairness is a random creation of human thought.

In other words if enough people paying no taxes still think it isn`t fair that others have more money they should be allowed to tax it away to be given to them.

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Response to swifty (Reply #44)

Mon Jan 29, 2018, 11:14 AM

Valishin (9,782 posts)

69. Actually fair taxation

absolutely is a straight line and easy. Its based on a percentage not a set amount but its still a straight line.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 03:50 PM

oflguy (19,942 posts)

57. This is how your mind works?

wow

sick

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sun Jan 28, 2018, 06:44 PM

rahtruelies (16,244 posts)

63. ******************SILLY RABBIT AWARD**********************

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