Politicspolitics

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:25 AM

If you wanted moral guidance, would you be able to trust an Evangelical Trump supporter?

I'm not talking about Evangelicals in general, of course, and I have absolutely nothing against them. On the contrary, I have a great deal of respect for Evangelical Christianity. My question is, "What have Evangelical Trump supporters done to their faith's moral and religious credibility?"

Suppose someone were seeking guidance and fellowship and needed or was leaning toward Evangelical Christianity. Then they find out that a very substantial number of Evangelicals supported (and some continue to support) Donald Trump. What if that seeking person turned away after seeing this fairly apparent display of wanton principle hedging and faith underperformance.

Is Trump worth it? If not, how can Evangelical Trump supporters undo the damage they have done?

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Reply If you wanted moral guidance, would you be able to trust an Evangelical Trump supporter? (Original post)
swifty Aug 25 OP
blue Aug 25 #1
rahtruelies Aug 25 #2
TheShoe Aug 25 #10
Da Mannn Aug 25 #3
swifty Aug 25 #4
blue Aug 25 #5
bobsal Aug 25 #9
blue Aug 25 #12
bobsal Aug 25 #17
blue Aug 25 #18
Tolk Aug 25 #13
Model10RB Aug 25 #14
blue Aug 25 #7
bobsal Aug 25 #6
blue Aug 25 #8
swifty Aug 25 #15
blue Aug 25 #16
swifty Aug 25 #19
Carl Aug 25 #20
swifty Aug 25 #21
blue Aug 25 #23
bobsal Aug 25 #22
blue Aug 25 #24
bobsal Aug 25 #27
Carl Aug 25 #11
Banshee 3 Actual Aug 25 #25
outside Aug 25 #26
nolidad Aug 25 #28

Response to swifty (Original post)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:30 AM

1. 2 reasons. Either/or.

1) They've kept their religion out of their politics.

2) They've taken in the less fortunate sinners (Trump) and hope for transformation and forgiveness.

Neither suggests that they've done anything to the credibility of their faith. It might make YOU mad, but that's on you, not them.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:32 AM

2. I certainly would not trust a bath house barry/klintoon demoRat or a Juan McCoward RINO

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Response to rahtruelies (Reply #2)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:47 AM

10. Of course you wouldnt

No one in romper room would.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:34 AM

3. Atheist Bigots. Judging Faith by a man's politics.

I learned long ago never to take spiritual advice from an atheist.
Atheists are ignorant of Godly matters. They only offer advice to manipulate people.

Why discuss Faith with a man who despises everything I believe?
Cast not pearls before swine.

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Response to Da Mannn (Reply #3)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:40 AM

4. How do you tell an atheist from someone who is pretending not to be?

I think of solid atheism as very philosophically and religiously dubious as well as pessimistic. But how can you tell whether someone has solid faith or is just mumbling the words to manipulate? Also, where do actions (such as voting and taking political positions) fit in?

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Response to swifty (Reply #4)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:45 AM

5. From the looks of this poll, it doesn't matter to you.

Most political liberals spend their days mocking those of the faith and they don't care if it is solid or manipulating.

Proof of it is shown in your poll. Your actions.

You attack people for being Christians.
You attack them for being republicans.
You then equate all of that to being racists or homophobes.
You attack them for being white, though you try to cover that up.

Then you play dumb and think "Who me? I really, really, REALLY just want to understand".

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Response to blue (Reply #5)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:47 AM

9. Speaking of smearing people.

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Response to bobsal (Reply #9)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:50 AM

12. The entire premise of the OP is a smear.

Most of swifters posts ARE smears and I pointed out how it works.

But you go on pretending it is an honest discussion.



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Response to blue (Reply #12)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:12 AM

17. No, there is no snear in that OP. And you are being disenguous it about by making your real smear.

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Response to bobsal (Reply #17)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:23 AM

18. Did your home church pastor vote for Trump?

Case closed.

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Response to blue (Reply #5)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:51 AM

13. Somebody has a problem with the truth

And alerted in bad faith.

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Response to blue (Reply #5)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:52 AM

14. Alerted

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Response to Da Mannn (Reply #3)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:46 AM

7. Cast not pearls before swine.

Yeah, you're right.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:45 AM

6. In a word, NO! I'd go to my home church pastor, exactly what Joyce Myers says to do ...

One thing I would not do is alert on this thread like some unchristian snowflake did.

Here's a chance to discuss where religion fits into politics and someone wants to kill the conversation.

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Response to bobsal (Reply #6)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:47 AM

8. I didn't alert, but it is a Christian bashing thread. Nothing more.

Hope that helps.

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Response to blue (Reply #8)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:01 AM

15. It isn't bashing anyone, Christian or not.

If you want to argue that supporting Trump doesn't undermine Evangelical Christians who do it, then fine. Make the argument. I think supporting Trump hurts Evangelical purposes as does not recognizing that supporting Trump hurts them.

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Response to swifty (Reply #15)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:10 AM

16. In the spirit of honesty, read your post again.

"What if that seeking person turned away after seeing this fairly apparent display of wanton principle hedging and faith underperformance.

Is Trump worth it? If not, how can Evangelical Trump supporters undo the damage they have done?"

Wanton principle? Underperformance? Damage? That's a lot of bashing words for someone who isn't bashing someone.

Now, you could rephrase that and say, for example, could a Christian that supports Trump also be a support to an individual who needed counsel? But you're not honestly asking that. Are you?

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Response to blue (Reply #16)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:24 AM

19. Would it be Christian bashing if I said...

...that Christians who don't care about the poor or others who could use help are guilty of "wanton principle hedging and underperforming their faith?" In no way. That's because caring about the poor or others in need are (I state with complete conviction) key principles of the faith. Trump's behavior (and making Trump the leader of hundreds of millions, if not, indirectly, billions of people) fairly apparently violate key principles of the faith.

The language is strong, but it is honest. And, yes, I am honestly pointing out that it is not only possible but very likely that supporting Trump undermines the credibility of Evangelicals in counseling and winning over others. It may be an uncomfortable "likely fact" but it is nevertheless an important and likely fact.

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Response to swifty (Reply #19)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:27 AM

20. Caring for the poor by demanding government take from someone else to give to them while themselves

doing nothing is pretty fucking evil in my book.

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Response to Carl (Reply #20)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:30 AM

21. I recommend doing both.

Voting isn't "demanding." Those who can help, should, imo. Also, sometimes (far, far from always), not helping is the best way to help.

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Response to swifty (Reply #19)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:35 AM

23. Your solution would be that Evangelicals don't vote.

Every human errors and has fallibility. Many of the policies of the United States are not in line with Christian standards.

Could you ever be "won over" by an evangelical promising you heaven? There again, if you place your faith in human beings, you'll never find what you're looking for.

Your answers can only be found by some deep soul searching on your part. Belittling others for their beliefs and walks in faith and VOTE, will never bring you answers.

Did Muslims vote for Trump? Buddhists? Catholics? Mormons? Atheists? How do they justify their faith with their political vote?

How come you don't ask about them?





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Response to blue (Reply #8)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:32 AM

22. I'm christian, been Lutheran for four generations, I didn't feel bashed. How do you feel bashed?

When Christ told me to treat others as I would be treated, to feed, clothe, shelter the needy - that when I do am feeding, clothing, sheltering Christ. That I should minister to the imprisoned, give ease the dispossessed .

What possible advice can I get from a person who supports the opposite of what Christ told us to do? From ministers who have no problem with Trump's cheating let alone the policies he promotes that are unchristian and unAmerican?

Surely to a christian yourself Trump has presented himself in all sorts of bad behavior you do not endorse. And then we get to his crimes as they have unfolded themselves and continue to unfold.

G*d has no problem lifting up sinners to lead his church, St Paul was serial mass murderer. But Trump has shown no inkling of being an instrument of G*d's will.

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Response to bobsal (Reply #22)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:40 AM

24. That is between Trump and his god. Not me.

He will need to reconcile all that if and when the time comes.

Did you vote for Trump?

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Response to blue (Reply #24)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 12:18 PM

27. No. I did not. The GOP hasn't given me a candidate I could vote for since GHW Bush. As a Republican,

this is a major source of consternation. I'd probably vote for Mitt Romney (except against Obama), I could vote for Jon Huntsman jr; half the time I could vote for Lindsay Graham, the other half of the time I think Trumps got the goods on a misstep or youthful indiscretion Trumps blackmailing him over. I could have voted for Chris Christi until he got too full of himself and was shown to be all up into himself.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 10:49 AM

11. How about you participate in your first stupid thread before starting another one?

Most normal people are capable of non binary thinking.

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:53 AM

25. You're right we should only trust a clinton for moral guidance

because as we know when it comes to morality the Clintons are godlike

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 11:56 AM

26. Was Preident Trump a Christian

before or after the womanizing?


I forgive him for his womanizing in his secular American life. The bar of morality in secular American is very low and he lived by that bar for years. If he confessed his sins to God and asked for forgiveness then he's gets a new start but the new moral bar is much higher.

Some of the most powerful Evangelical pastors in America are ex felons, ex drug addicts and ex alcoholics. Read the Bible and see some of the biggest heroes in the book were not good people but they had something that God needed to use.

Born again, A new person in Christ Jesus.

I wonder what Paula White said to Donald Trump that day in 2011 and what happened to him to make that call to her?

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Response to swifty (Original post)

Sat Aug 25, 2018, 04:40 PM

28. Your error is that you are trying to things together that are not equal!

I voted for Trump because he was the least offensive of two candidates. Many evangelicals did the same!

Also there had been reports that he had given his life to Christ (whether or not only God knows), but that at least he mouths many of tthe values many Christians believe in!

Toi have cast a vote for HIllary would have been a far worse moral choice!

1. open support for abortion
2. open support for gay marriage (vs. civil unions)
3. Violated numerous federal codes and flaunted it!
4. When Bill was dallying like Trump had- she went on a path of personal destruction against the women Bill had cheated with.
5. Stole white house furniture upon leaving and had to send it back and her staff and Bills caused over $180,000 in damage to the white house when they left!


I voted for a politician not a pastor!

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