Politicspolitics

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:24 AM

A Yes or No will do...

...there are many militarily proficient people here on DI...answer me this,

Do we have the technology to have fooled the radar, of the older Russian/Iranian surface to air missile that shot down the Iranian civilian airliner, into believing that airliner was a U.S. military aircraft?

...a simple Yes or No will do...

40 replies, 444 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 40 replies Author Time Post
Reply A Yes or No will do... (Original post)
myohmy Jan 14 OP
Solesurvivor Jan 14 #1
Qukid Jan 14 #2
Muddling Through Jan 14 #3
Gunslinger201 Jan 14 #4
Carlos W Bush Jan 14 #5
rampartb Jan 14 #6
quad489 Jan 14 #8
foia Jan 14 #15
quad489 Jan 14 #18
foia Jan 14 #19
quad489 Jan 14 #7
Steelydamned Jan 14 #9
HerasHeaddress Jan 14 #10
R. Cavu Jan 14 #11
Da Mannn Jan 14 #12
Charlie Mike Jan 14 #13
Steelydamned Jan 14 #14
quad489 Jan 14 #20
Daves Not Here Man Jan 14 #16
_eek Jan 14 #17
cologeek Jan 14 #21
Banshee 3 Actual Jan 14 #22
DDKick Jan 14 #23
His Daughter Jan 14 #24
myohmy Jan 14 #25
_eek Jan 14 #26
myohmy Wednesday #28
_eek Wednesday #31
myohmy Wednesday #32
_eek Wednesday #34
Charlie Mike Wednesday #29
shogun Jan 14 #27
Valishin Wednesday #30
myohmy Wednesday #33
_eek Wednesday #35
myohmy Wednesday #36
_eek Wednesday #37
myohmy Wednesday #39
_eek Thursday #40
TendiesForBreakfast Wednesday #38

Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:26 AM

1. I refuse to give a yes or no since you never answer us with a simple yes or no.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:30 AM

2. Blame America first

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:31 AM

3. Obvious Troll is Obvious.

Carry on Obvious Troll.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:36 AM

4. Yes

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:37 AM

5. Why do you hate America?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:44 AM

6. yes

but it might require closer proximity than I think possible in this case.

I think we are talking about a young lieutenant with grave responsibility and insufficient experience to determine what was headed his way very quickly.

the Iranians have more modern home made air defense systems, but this may have been a shah era made in usa "hawk" system.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to rampartb (Reply #6)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:50 AM

8. And why would they use some old ''usa ''hawk'' system'' to protect their capital city???

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to quad489 (Reply #8)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 10:17 AM

15. And what are the chances that a 40 year old SAM is even operational?

I'm pretty sure that its "best if used by" date would be long expired.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to foia (Reply #15)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 10:33 AM

18. Yep...and you really gotta wonder about those who are defending the mullah controlled Iran govt...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to quad489 (Reply #18)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 10:38 AM

19. What they lack in common sense they make up for with mind-numbing stupidity.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:48 AM

7. How could an American aircraft just appeared at the Tehran airport without other iranian air defense

radar installations picking up that aircraft approaching the area beforehand??? You really believe our aircraft have jump capabilities???

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:51 AM

9. No.

It was the satellite based, mind control beams that tricked the Iranians into thinking an commercial aircraft, taking off from THEIR own airport, was actually a US plane or missile

These same mind control beams also cause them to vehemently deny any responsibility...until the effects wore off and they realized what they had done and no choice but to come clean.

Please use the Heavy Duty Reynolds wrap in your next hat so they don't get you as well.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:51 AM

10. Why can't you

take Iran at its word when it says it shot the plane down accidentally? You guys have believed everything else Iran has put out there. Orange Man and America Scary Bad!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 09:05 AM

11. A Yes or No will do...

Do you believe only one plane took off that night from the country’s biggest airport?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 09:25 AM

12. Any computer hacker could do this. But it is not likely in this case.

you do not have to fool the radar just the computer that runs the missile system.

that said, the hacker would need to know the specific computer running that particular -mobile- missile launcher.

worse still, the Launcher is not hooked up to the internet...its a closed system. We would need a man on the ground to have accessed the launcher prior to the event...knowing that this would be the one protecting the airport.

The simplest explanation is always the likely one...Human error and incompetence is what shot down the airliner, NOT some sinister plot by the US govt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 09:30 AM

13. This one is getting bookmarked.

Screen captured too.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 09:39 AM

14. Iran announces arrests have been made over downing of plane that killed 176

TEHRAN, Iran (AP) — Iran said Tuesday that authorities have made arrests for the accidental shootdown of a Ukrainian passenger plane, which killed all 176 people on board and set off protests in the country demanding accountability after officials initially concealed the cause of the crash.

Iran’s Judiciary spokesman Gholamhossein Esmaili said “some individuals” were arrested after “extensive investigations.” His statement on the judiciary’s website did not say how many people had been detained or name those arrested.

Iran at first dismissed allegations that a missile had brought down the plane, but in the face of mounting evidence officials acknowledged on Saturday — three days after — that its Revolutionary Guard had shot down the plane by mistake as the force braced for a possible military confrontation with the United States.

The plane, en route from Tehran to the Ukrainian capital of Kyiv, was carrying 167 passengers and nine crew members from several countries, including 82 Iranians and 57 Canadians, many of whom were Iranians with dual citizenship. There were several children among the passengers, including an infant.

Iran’s president on Tuesday called for a special court with “a ranking judge and dozens of experts” to be set up to probe the incident.

“The responsibility falls on more than just one person,” President Hassan Rouhani said in a televised speech, adding that those found culpable “should be punished.”

“There are others, too, and I want that this issue is expressed honestly,” he said, without elaborating.

Rouhani called the incident “a painful and unforgivable” mistake and promised that his administration would pursue the case “by all means.”

“This is not an ordinary case. The entire the world will be watching this court,” he said.

Tensions have been escalating since President Donald Trump pulled the U.S. out of Iran’s 2015 nuclear deal with world powers, then reimposed sanctions that had been lifted under the accord.

The deal has quickly unraveled since then, with Iran steadily breaking away from limits on its nuclear program and Europe unable to find ways to keep Tehran committed.

The U.S. sanctions have devastated Iran’s economy.

On Tuesday, Britain, France and Germany triggered the so-called “dispute mechanism” action that paves way for possible further sanctions in response to Iran’s moves.

....Read the whole thing: https://apnews.com/40f1b9bd475d23bd5d2977ff2e473d7b

Fascinating though. We’ve gone from there’s no missing plane to mechanical failure to terrible mistake, finally arriving at we’re arresting some members of our own Revolutionary Guard. It’s been quite the roller coaster ride these past few days, hasn’t it?

So tell me myohmy; is it always your first instinct to blame the US while ignoring Iran's flagrant human rights abuses and nefarious support of terrorism for decades?

A simple yes or no will do.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Steelydamned (Reply #14)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 10:38 AM

20. Yep, and the buck stops at President Hassan Rouhani too. Lets see how he punishes himself.

"“The responsibility falls on more than just one person,” President Hassan Rouhani said in a televised speech, adding that those found culpable “should be punished.”"

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 10:18 AM

16. goddamn, dude...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 10:30 AM

17. no

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 11:52 AM

21. Ask leading questions much?

Sorry, I'll speak my mind in detail, not for a cheap setup.

Technically would it be possible? Sure.

Would it be practical to try? No, not really.

Why would we bother to do it?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 12:06 PM

22. Literally not that simple Airliners have transponders which emit a signal

that signal tells ground control and military what the aircraft is and can be changed inflight during an emergency

IIRC 7500 means aircraft hijacked

but unless you physically changed it out it will not say it was a US Fighter or Bomber under IFF




I know you suddenly believe Sputniks trolling theory but it isnt true

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 12:12 PM

23. I do believe that our forces were under attack.

I believe they took defensive actions. They worked apparently. If a commercial jet decided to take off in an active battle it is on them first and the person who pushed the button second.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 12:36 PM

24. Anything along those lines would need to be physically present to do that

It would have to receive the radar signal, modify it, and then send it back. It would have to be done for every radar operating in the area. Not practical in a multi radar environment such as an airport. Also it is not clear what it would modify it to. Generating returns that looked like attack aircraft would result in the missile not hitting anything.

That said, any launch should only be done with concurrence from higher command on targets identified by multiple sensors within the integrated air defense network. You don't launch based on a single id from a single site, especially in peacetime.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 06:15 PM

25. thanks everyone...

...I wasn't looking to assess blame, I was just curious about the state-of-art of our sophisticated military technology...

..since I respect the military expertise on DI, I'll take it to mean 'yes' we do have the technology but it wasn't likely used in this instance...

...May God Bless America...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Reply #25)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:44 PM

26. Ah, you found exactly what you wanted to hear.

Not one person of any credibility said that.

You are too ignorant of the ideas and tech to even know what questions to ask.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to _eek (Reply #26)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 02:11 AM

28. Mr. Expert...

..you say nothing very profoundly...

...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Reply #28)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 04:20 PM

31. At least you ar aware enough to admit my mastery.

Though praise from swine means absolutely nothing.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to _eek (Reply #31)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 06:05 PM

32. 'swine'...

...now that wasn't very nice...

...did I hurt your feelings?...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Reply #32)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 06:48 PM

34. Yes, deeply.

doubt I will ever recover.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Reply #25)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 05:23 AM

29. Yeah, that was dumb.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Tue Jan 14, 2020, 08:55 PM

27. I have no idea

But I do know that the political factions that supported the invasion in Iraq and have worked to spread chaos in the middle east, did everything in their power to try and stop President Trump.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 11:20 AM

30. It depends on what you mean by fooled the radar

if you mean hacked the system sure that's possible but you would need physical access to several redundant systems. Ultimately its a computer it can say whatever you want, so that capability exists but I don't think that is what you were referring to.

I think what you had in mind was some sort of Star Trek style trick where they use their sensor array to create phantom images or warp the signal from a distance. That technology does not currently exist and we aren't anywhere near it.

What would be possible, however amazingly difficult to pull off would be to use a drone to shadow an aircraft creating two signals from a single location. However, that would not replace the signal from the airliner it would create confusion however there would be a record of the situation easy to follow during after action analysis.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Valishin (Reply #30)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 06:16 PM

33. thank you...

" I think what you had in mind was some sort of Star Trek style trick where they use their sensor array to create phantom images or warp the signal from a distance. That technology does not currently exist and we aren't anywhere near it. "

...yes, that's what I had in mind...

...so the answer is 'no', we do not have the technology that could create an image that would fool the guidance of a surface-to-air missile...

...interesting...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Reply #33)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 06:53 PM

35. This right here...

create an image..

What do you mean by image?

In all seriousness, what do you understand about how ADA works?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to _eek (Reply #35)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 07:16 PM

36. "...what do you understand about how ADA works?"

...I understand very little about how they work...that's why the original question...

"What do you mean by image?"

...'image'...I was using Valishin's term describing what I imagined...

...I thought we had more ability to coerce an inflight missile than we apparently have...

...


Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Reply #36)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 07:24 PM

37. No, those are closed systems.

And as he said, we do not have the ability to project targets, especially over another. Most of our tech involves masking, and evasion.

Where did you get the idea this could be possible, I find it an odd thing to think actually possible, let alone probable.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to _eek (Reply #37)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 10:49 PM

39. "Where did you get the idea this could be possible,"

...it seemed like a capability we would have developed...

...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Reply #39)

Thu Jan 16, 2020, 08:04 AM

40. It really doesn't.

It sounds like Alex Jones nonsense, or movie hand wave magic.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to myohmy (Original post)

Wed Jan 15, 2020, 07:42 PM

38. No.

Not in any practical way.

The SA-15 is a missile system operating independently of the rest of the air defense network. Compromising that system in such a way would require someone physically present.

More likely than not, some SA-15 crew saw an object on radar flying at the speed and altitude of a cruise missile and had what they believed to be only a matter of seconds to make a decision.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Politicspolitics