Politicssanderseconomy

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:19 AM

real unemployment rate is actually 10.5%

http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/07/06/sanders-real-unemployment-is-actually-over-10/
SANDERS: ‘REAL UNEMPLOYMENT’ IS ACTUALLY OVER 10%
Democratic presidential candidate Bernie Sanders claimed that the “real unemployment” rate is actually 10.5%, almost double the official government figure of 5.3%, during a speech in Portland, ME on Monday.

Sanders said, “When you talk about the economy we also have to have an honest assessment of unemployment in America. Now, once a month the government publishes a set of figures, and the last figures they published said that official unemployment was 5.4 percent. But there is another set of government statistics, and that says that real unemployment, if you include those people who have given up looking for work, and the millions of others who are working part-time 20, 25 hours a week when they want to work full-time, when you all of that together, real unemployment is 10.5 percent.”

84 replies, 7220 views

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Reply real unemployment rate is actually 10.5% (Original post)
Jack Burton Jul 2015 OP
JosephNobles Jul 2015 #1
Jack Burton Jul 2015 #4
JosephNobles Jul 2015 #8
John Q Citizen Jul 2015 #78
Dexter Morgan Jul 2015 #2
JosephNobles Jul 2015 #5
Dexter Morgan Jul 2015 #6
JosephNobles Jul 2015 #12
Dexter Morgan Jul 2015 #20
JosephNobles Jul 2015 #25
Dexter Morgan Jul 2015 #32
JosephNobles Jul 2015 #37
Supercalifragilistic Jul 2015 #79
JosephNobles Jul 2015 #83
Jack Burton Jul 2015 #7
JosephNobles Jul 2015 #9
Jack Burton Jul 2015 #15
JosephNobles Jul 2015 #16
Gamle-ged Jul 2015 #38
EagleKeeper Jul 2015 #9
JosephNobles Jul 2015 #13
DavesNotHere Jul 2015 #51
Dexter Morgan Jul 2015 #53
DavesNotHere Jul 2015 #54
Dexter Morgan Jul 2015 #55
Gamle-ged Jul 2015 #3
ProudNYSTaxPayer Jul 2015 #63
SonderWoman Jul 2015 #11
shortviking Jul 2015 #60
Noumenon Jul 2015 #14
EagleKeeper Jul 2015 #17
Noumenon Jul 2015 #18
EagleKeeper Jul 2015 #22
Noumenon Jul 2015 #23
JoePolitics Jul 2015 #27
Noumenon Jul 2015 #29
EagleKeeper Jul 2015 #28
Noumenon Jul 2015 #33
JoePolitics Jul 2015 #44
SonderWoman Jul 2015 #21
Noumenon Jul 2015 #24
nopoliticalsaviors Jul 2015 #30
Noumenon Jul 2015 #34
nopoliticalsaviors Jul 2015 #41
Trainman95630 Jul 2015 #46
Noumenon Jul 2015 #49
Pony Express Jul 2015 #59
Noumenon Jul 2015 #70
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #19
nopoliticalsaviors Jul 2015 #36
shortviking Jul 2015 #61
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #64
nopoliticalsaviors Jul 2015 #69
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #71
nopoliticalsaviors Jul 2015 #72
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #73
nopoliticalsaviors Jul 2015 #75
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #76
nopoliticalsaviors Jul 2015 #80
nopoliticalsaviors Jul 2015 #74
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #77
nopoliticalsaviors Jul 2015 #81
JoeHill Jul 2015 #26
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #31
EagleKeeper Jul 2015 #35
Gamle-ged Jul 2015 #39
EagleKeeper Jul 2015 #42
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #47
Dexter Morgan Jul 2015 #40
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #43
Dexter Morgan Jul 2015 #50
JoePolitics Jul 2015 #45
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #48
JoePolitics Jul 2015 #52
nopoliticalsaviors Jul 2015 #57
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #62
JoeHill Jul 2015 #84
Junglejim43 Jul 2015 #56
EagleKeeper Jul 2015 #58
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #65
Junglejim43 Jul 2015 #66
Gr8Daze Jul 2015 #67
Gamle-ged Jul 2015 #68
Cardinals1982 Jul 2015 #82

Response to Jack Burton (Original post)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:22 AM

1. My candidate. He's a card.

Nice little gotcha headline there, Jack.

Here's the full speech.

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Response to JosephNobles (Reply #1)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:30 AM

4. What "gotcha headline"??

I'm just agreeing with Bernie.

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Response to Jack Burton (Reply #4)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:33 AM

8. The gotcha is that you don't attribute it to Sanders in your headline.

You got a little



going on.

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Response to Jack Burton (Reply #4)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 06:23 PM

78. Yep, I agree with Bernie. And under bush it was

close to 20%

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Response to Jack Burton (Original post)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:27 AM

2. Sanders needs to hire a food taster and drive around in a bullet proof limo...How dare he contradict

the democratic party....

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Response to Dexter Morgan (Reply #2)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:30 AM

5. Why are you flying the flag of the Democratic Party in your avatar?

After all, that's what I keep getting told about the Confederate flag and the KKK - they were all Democrats, right?

Why do you have a Democratic Party flag in your avatar?

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Response to JosephNobles (Reply #5)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:32 AM

6. Cause for some reason it pisses of Democrats....Go figure.....

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Response to Dexter Morgan (Reply #6)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:35 AM

12. Maybe that's because Democrats have repudiated that flag and all it represents

Maybe that's because the racists took their flag and went to the Republican Party. Or call themselves "independent" now but vote with the Republicans 10 times out of 10.

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Response to JosephNobles (Reply #12)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:42 AM

20. Or maybe the democrats don't like to be reminded of history?

From what i remember of history after the republicans got the civil rights act and the voting rights act passed ,no thanks to the democrats....
The democrats formed the KKK to kill blacks and republicans and then all those democrats left the racist party to go join the party that fought for the rights of blacks..
You cannot make up this stuff..

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Response to Dexter Morgan (Reply #20)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:48 AM

25. Your memory of history is WRONG.

"after the republicans got the civil rights act and the voting rights act passed ,no thanks to the democrats.... "

A Democratic president signed the bills, Dexter. The Democratic Party was split in Congress over the bills, but Democrats did indeed contribute to the vote. And they wouldn't be law without LBJ's signature.

"The democrats formed the KKK to kill blacks and republicans "

Now you're just hopelessly confused. The KKK was formed in the 1860's and resurged in the 1920's and the 1950's. The Civil Rights Act and the Voting Rights Act were passed in the 1960's. The KKK was not formed "after" the CRA and the VRA (your words).

"You cannot make up this stuff.."

Actually you can. You just did.

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Response to JosephNobles (Reply #25)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:00 AM

32. Yes you are correct the democrats formed the KKK after the civil war to control blacks

and republicans...and as for LBJ..LOL..


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Response to Dexter Morgan (Reply #32)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:08 AM

37. Some Democrats

And their spiritual descendants today still fly their flag.

Not you, of course! But when people think such horrible things of you when you wave that flag, you have to understand.

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Response to JosephNobles (Reply #12)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 07:30 PM

79. Lol...Sanders is Independent

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Response to Supercalifragilistic (Reply #79)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:56 PM

83. Sanders is a Socialist.

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Response to JosephNobles (Reply #5)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:32 AM

7. Why? Because

he's just showing his pride in Democratic Party achievements and culture.

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Response to Jack Burton (Reply #7)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:34 AM

9. Dexter is not a Democrat, though.

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Response to JosephNobles (Reply #9)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:37 AM

15. One can take pride in the accomplishments of others.

I'm not a NFL football player either. But I can still take pride in a team such as the Washington Redskins.

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Response to Jack Burton (Reply #15)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:40 AM

16. So you're saying he's proud of segregation and racism and white supremacy?

The things associated with that flag, the kinds of things the Democratic Party repudiated when it showed the Southern conservative racist vote the door?

That's a terrible thing for you to say, Jack. Even if it's true, it's terrible to say.

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Response to JosephNobles (Reply #16)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:18 AM

38. "...the Democratic Party repudiated when it showed the Southern conservative racist vote the door.."



Democrats rode the White racists to victory until LBJ decided that it was getting too risky, and that Republicans might gain too much of the Black vote, so LBJ changed the party's horse mid-stream and rode the Black vote to victory by providing Black politicians with safe districts, ensuring loyalty in that newly emerging political group. A new care of political Democrat racists gradually emerged, Jackson, Sharpton et al, only the color had changed! Now Democrat politicians are working on a new, fresh group from south of the border. The more things change, etc.

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Response to JosephNobles (Reply #5)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:34 AM

9. 10.5% Joe...He's your boy.

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Response to EagleKeeper (Reply #9)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:36 AM

13. Dexter's a Democrat?

I wouldn't let him hear you say that.

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Response to Dexter Morgan (Reply #2)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:46 AM

51. Some people just can't stand the fact that

The president is black.

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Response to DavesNotHere (Reply #51)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:47 AM

53. Are you calling Sanders a racist?

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Response to Dexter Morgan (Reply #53)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:50 AM

54. Of course not, I'll leave that for Clinton's people.

I just thought that was the expected response whenever someone has any criticism of the current administration.

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Response to DavesNotHere (Reply #54)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:59 AM

55. Yes it's a quandary,can't really play the race card on one of your own,life would be so much simpler

if Sanders was a Republican...

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Response to Jack Burton (Original post)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:29 AM

3. Must be the first Democrat (in waiting) to bring up the real unemployment figure while a Democrat...

.. holds the presidency!...

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Response to Gamle-ged (Reply #3)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 02:14 PM

63. No one ever brought up the U6

until rush started talking about it in 2009. If you want to use it as the standard that is fine but people have to understand that when people talk about unemployment under Bush or Reagan they are talking about completely different baselines.

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Response to Jack Burton (Original post)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:35 AM

11. So make sure you all vote for Sanders!

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Response to SonderWoman (Reply #11)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 01:54 PM

60. I probably will.

 

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Response to Jack Burton (Original post)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:36 AM

14. Actually that probably isn't a great stat for Bernie to argue...

Bush's meltdown was really bad. Obama ain't great, but as you can see in the plot he's got it back down to things we *HAVE* seen before. Just showing that Obama seems to have done a pretty good job given the big GOP elephant turd he was handed.



Explanations of the difference between the classes is here:

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t15.htm

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Response to Noumenon (Reply #14)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:40 AM

17. So...Obama's 5.3 figure is a lie then?

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Response to EagleKeeper (Reply #17)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:42 AM

18. Why don't you read the whole set of links and find out?

Sheesh conservatives just won't read anything. Intellectually lazy.

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Response to Noumenon (Reply #18)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:44 AM

22. The Bern says real unemployment is 10.5%...

Obama says it's 5.3%...one of them is lying, I wonder who it could be?!?

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Response to EagleKeeper (Reply #22)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:44 AM

23. Neither. Don't be ignorant.

One quotes U-3, the other quotes U-6. Both are useful considering what question you want to answer.

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Response to Noumenon (Reply #23)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:51 AM

27. Some of our RW friends can't read graphs.

They don't get it,

Multiple metrics all very highly correlated.

They don't get it.

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Response to JoePolitics (Reply #27)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:53 AM

29. I know. It's not like I didn't link to an explanation.

Faced with any subtlety at all (or worse, actual mathematics) I guess it's easier to light their hair on fire and start running around screaming "someone lies!!!!"

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Response to Noumenon (Reply #23)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:51 AM

28. So...You tell me...

The Bern says 10.5
Obama says 5.3

Who am I to believe? Please explain it to me like I'm a likely LIV.

BTW I've known it's been 10+ for a long time but that's not the way the administration has ever framed the disagreement.

I applaude Bernie speaking truth to power and all that.

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Response to EagleKeeper (Reply #28)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:01 AM

33. As far as explaining it to you, consider this tough love:


Give an answer to a con, they will call it a lie. Teach a con to read AND comprehend and they won't be a con anymore.

They are talking about two different ways to discuss unemployment, U-3 and U-6.

They are defined right here: http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t15.htm

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Response to EagleKeeper (Reply #28)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:38 AM

44. They are using 2 DIFFERENT metrics.

The one Obama is using, UE-3 ... Bernie is using UE-6.

Here is a handy description of each ...
http://www.bls.gov/lau/stalt.htm

If you look up thread, you'll see a handy graph that shows the extent to which they measures are correlated.

HINT: They are very highly correlated.

UE-3 is the metric that is traditionally used. Its the metric that was used the entire time Clinton and Bush were President. Its the one Obama is referring to.

The folks using UE-6 are hoping that you are (a) too stupid to understand that they are using a different metric than the one traditionally used, and (b) incapable of noticing that these metrics are very highly correlated (meaning that they move up and down at almost the exact same rate).

Pick anyone of the metrics you want, and it has improved at the same rate as all of the other variations of this metric, during the Obama Presidency.

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Response to EagleKeeper (Reply #17)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:43 AM

21. What was the "real" unemployment rate when it was at 10.2%?

Either way its been cut in half.

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Response to SonderWoman (Reply #21)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:47 AM

24. Not quite half. But on the graph I showed

the decrease was sharper compared to the others in history.

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Response to Noumenon (Reply #14)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:54 AM

30. Obama hasn't done shit...

but funnel more of the wealth created by the workers into the hands of Wall Street thieves and ruling class parasites. Claiming that Obama and the Democratic Party - in its present form - has done a fucking thing to stop that is beyond laughable and one of the reasons why the actual left has been silenced and marginalized. That is objective material reality and the facts on the ground and that reality doesn't take any R vs D partisan sales job to prove it. Let's hope Sanders at least continues to call out bullshit for what is when discussing the plight of workers and what's happening on the ground.

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Response to nopoliticalsaviors (Reply #30)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:05 AM

34. Hey you ain't necessarily wrong.

But on the statistic that is being argued, apparently you could conclude that funneling wealth from workers to Wall Street has in some small way created enough jobs to lower the rate a bit. Not that I am endorsing that.

The trend has been downward the entire duration of Obama's administration, not counting the crash which spanned both administrations. You can argue he didn't do it, but he certainly didn't screw it up either.

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Response to Noumenon (Reply #34)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:24 AM

41. I don't have any desire to be right or wrong...

when the discussion involves scoring political points - for "one side" or the other in the D vs R sideshow - while the real people and workers on the ground are being trampled under foot by the current social arrangements of capitalist barbarity.

The only sides are Labor vs Capital and who is winning that very real battle on the ground. It isn't labor and the workers. If someone is on the right side... they will aim to change that in all arrangements and relations (political, economic, social).

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Response to Noumenon (Reply #14)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:40 AM

46. For goodness sake at what point does baby black Jesus

 

actually start being responsible for the economy. At some point the old I was cleaning up after last night's kegger excuse gets very old. BBJ needs to man the fuck up.

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Response to Trainman95630 (Reply #46)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:44 AM

49. Absolutely. The new captain of the Titanic is a complete loser for

not taking the ship out on a new cruise too!

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Response to Noumenon (Reply #14)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 01:47 PM

59. Obama's U-6 Unemployment Biggest Drop on Record

from 17.3% to 10.5%

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Response to Pony Express (Reply #59)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 03:49 PM

70. On the graph, the slope is very steep...

though whether that was simply because Bush's goofups put us in a nonlinear region where recovery was swift or good policy (of which there were a couple) is not clear.

The only thing that you can say for sure is that President Obama certainly didn't screw up and likely did rather well given the mess.

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Response to Jack Burton (Original post)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:42 AM

19. Another reason I'm not a Bernie fan

He's latched onto the "the sky is falling" republican format of campaigning.

I've been in business for decades and I can tell you there is one really good indicator to me of when the unemployment rate is low. The applications sent in for good paying full time jobs falls drastically. In 2008-10 I was getting a hundred or more applicants for a job. Now I get maybe 5.

I've seen that cycle repeat itself many times over the years.

In addition the data shows part time versus full time jobs have not increased at all.

Bernie is just a politician like any other.

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #19)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:06 AM

36. The sky IS falling...

for the working poor and those dispossessed everywhere. To ignore that is to live in a bubble (in which all owners do as you've so aptly admitted in your little screed) and not deal in the realities of THE WHOLE of the people. The glass is not half full or half empty for the majority of working class people...the glass is smashed all over the floor.

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Response to nopoliticalsaviors (Reply #36)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 01:55 PM

61. +1

 

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Response to nopoliticalsaviors (Reply #36)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 02:21 PM

64. So what's his plan to fix it?

He never explains. Maybe you know?

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #64)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 03:34 PM

69. Leftists do not believe Capitalism can be "fixed"...

to satisfy the human needs of the whole. It doesn't work that way. That being said...there might be some value in the Sanders campaign as an organizing tool and raising class awareness among the workers, the poor, and those being shat upon daily by the ruling class. Sanders is proposing some things that would be part of any leftist platform.

How much can he get done and what concessions can he get in a power structure that answers to Capital is the question. Without agitation and organization of the workers and people behind him... probably nothing. He will get nothing done without the workers and the people - who believe in economic and social justice for all - shouting and putting forth their demands from every rooftop and every street corner and leading the way. Political action is about much more than just voting for a savior that can change things. There is much more to be done than just relying on that.

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Response to nopoliticalsaviors (Reply #69)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 03:56 PM

71. If by "leftists" you mean extremists...

I agree with you. But most liberals are not extremist or anti-capitalist.

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #71)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 05:26 PM

72. Seeing nobody replied I'll post it just for you...

because it was directed at those who play your insidious and despicable game and try and marginalize the actual left. The leftists who stand with labor, who stand with the workers, who stand with the poor, who stand with the marginalized, who stand with fighting savage inequality, and who stand with putting the well being and needs of the people first before profit and greed. People are catching on to that status quo business as usual noise you present and are not buying it.

The Legacy of McCarthyism
--by Ellen Schrecker

http://www.english.illinois.edu/maps/mccarthy/schrecker6.htm

(Snips)

"Quantification aside, it may be helpful to look at the specific sectors of American society that McCarthyism touched. Such an appraisal, tentative though it must be, may offer some insight into the extent of the damage and into the ways in which the anti-Communist crusade influenced American society, politics, and culture. We should keep in mind, however, that McCarthyism's main impact may well have been in what did not happen rather than in what did the social reforms that were never adopted, the diplomatic initiatives that were not pursued, the workers who were not organized into unions, the books that were not written, and the movies that were never filmed."

"The most obvious casualty was the American left. The institutional toll is clear. The Communist party, already damaged by internal problems, dwindled into insignificance and all the organizations associated with it disappeared. The destruction of the front groups and the left-led unions may well have had a more deleterious impact on American politics than the decline of the party itself. With their demise, the nation lost the institutional network that had created a public space where serious alternatives to the status quo could be presented. Moreover, with the disappearance of a vigorous movement on their left, moderate reform groups were more exposed to right-wing attacks and thus rendered less effective."

"In the realm of social policy, for example, McCarthyism may have aborted much-needed reforms. As the nation's politics swung to the right after World War II, the federal government abandoned the unfinished agenda of the New Deal. Measures like national health insurance, a social reform embraced by the rest of the industrialized world, simply fell by the wayside. The left liberal political coalition that might have supported health reforms and similar projects was torn apart by the anti-Communist crusade. Moderates feared being identified with anything that seemed too radical, and people to the left of them were either unheard or under attack. McCarthyism further contributed to the attenuation of the reform impulse by helping to divert the attention of the labor movement, the strongest institution within the old New Deal coalition, from external organizing to internal politicking."

"The nation's cultural and intellectual life suffered as well. While there were other reasons that TV offered a bland menu of quiz shows and westerns during the late 1950s, McCarthy-era anxieties clearly played a role. Similarly, the blacklist contributed to the reluctance of the film industry to grapple with controversial social or political issues. In the intellectual world, cold war liberals also avoided controversy. They celebrated the "end of ideology," claiming that the United States' uniquely pragmatic approach to politics made the problems that had once concerned left- wing ideologists irrelevant. Consensus historians pushed that formulation into the past and described a nation that had supposedly never experienced serious internal conflict. It took the civil rights movement and the Vietnam War to end this complacency and bring reality back in. "

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Response to nopoliticalsaviors (Reply #72)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 05:32 PM

73. How about your own words?

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #73)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 05:47 PM

75. Those were my words ...

the article was to drive the point home on the complicity your posts reveal in the destruction of the working class and the poor.

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Response to nopoliticalsaviors (Reply #75)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 06:07 PM

76. Why did you put quotes on them then?

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #76)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 08:34 PM

80. No quotes in the intro directed at your post...

it seems you are unable to defend your position and have nothing of substance in reply. Very sad...

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #71)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 05:32 PM

74. You may ponder this also...

On Progressive “Red-Baiting”

by Tamara K. Nopper

http://www.blackagendareport.com/print/content/progressive-%E2%80%9Cred-baiting%E2%80%9D

(Snip)

"Red-baiting of course is not new and today many people throw the word leftist as well as radical, revolutionary, Socialist, Communist, or Anarchist, around like they are accusations rather than oppositional, albeit diverging, positions against capitalism, the state, and for some of us, white supremacy. Most of the people who are the most vociferous in publicly denouncing leftists are white conservatives, including corporate news personalities and members of the inherently racist and white nationalist Tea Party. Yet progressives critical of racism, poverty, corporations, and government officials have their own ways of red-baiting."

(Snip)

" Not all of the targets of this red-baiting of which I speak are associated with Marxist organizations or have specific organizational affiliations. Nor do most progressives publicly use pejoratives such as “Commie” or “Pinko.” Yet some will easily use terms such as “authoritarian leftist,” “radicals” or “revolutionaries” when trying to deflect questions posed by people unimpressed with their political positions but whose opposition cannot easily be dismissed as driven by white supremacy or conservatism. In the process, these progressives often avoid having to explain why they are committed to the positions they take by calling their critics “radicals” or “revolutionaries,” thus situating their positions as logical or natural as opposed to ideological. Such gestures are consistent with red-baiting; individuals can simply shut down inquiry or interrogation of their political positions by using labels that are unpopular among a general public trained to hate such terms due to the aggressive campaigns by the mainstream press, most academics, and the state to demonize and criminalize stances that are too oppositional."

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Response to nopoliticalsaviors (Reply #74)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 06:08 PM

77. I'm sure right wing extremists

.... Have similar justifications.

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #77)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 08:40 PM

81. Maybe it's never occured to you that doing the bidding of Capital...

and trying to shut down leftist political discussion of class analysis and class struggle IS the work of the Right Wing ? Own it.

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Response to Jack Burton (Original post)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:50 AM

26. It's great to see the RepubliCons finally give a ship about unemployment

 

now that Bush is gone.

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Response to JoeHill (Reply #26)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:58 AM

31. And it's sad to see Bernie latch on to a bogus....

Right wing talking point. Wouldn't you agree?

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #31)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:05 AM

35. So Bernies lying then?!?

Ugh...It's all so confusing!

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Response to EagleKeeper (Reply #35)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:21 AM

39. I know, let's ask Hillary! I'm sure she will be forthright about the matter...

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Response to Gamle-ged (Reply #39)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:30 AM

42. Well, it seems that one reporter got past the rope line...

But she has to change first...I always hated wedding rice.

But hope remains!

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Response to Gamle-ged (Reply #39)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:42 AM

47. I'm sure she would

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #31)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:24 AM

40. Are you calling the democratic candidate a liar?

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Response to Dexter Morgan (Reply #40)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:34 AM

43. It's a bogus talking point

adjective
not genuine or true; fake.
"a bogus insurance claim"
synonyms: fake, spurious, false, fraudulent, sham, deceptive; More
antonyms: genuine

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #43)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:44 AM

50. So you are calling him a liar..Got it....

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #31)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:40 AM

45. Its a shame to see Bernie play this game ...

... the GOP assumes its base will never get the difference between UE3 and UE6.

My guess is that Bernie is trying to attract some of them.

No one on the left would fall for it.

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Response to JoePolitics (Reply #45)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:43 AM

48. Sadly hordes on the left will fall for it

But yes, he is trying to attract GOPers. That's my feeling too.

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #48)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:47 AM

52. There is a segment on the left ...

... that is just as crazy as the far right ... both sides hoping for and economic Armageddon, in which the current system fails.

After which ... their preferred version of Utopia rises from the ashes.

For the RW ... a Christian theocracy. For the LW ... a socialist paradise.

Neither explains how their version of Utopia springs from those ashes.

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Response to JoePolitics (Reply #52)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 12:18 PM

57. And once again your post reveals...

where you stand and reinforces your commitment to the status quo and business as usual. That business as usual stance makes you an opponent of any real and lasting policy or actual reform that might change the plight of the workers and the poor. You also fail to grasp history in that you ignore the very real struggle and life on the line commitment put forth by the "crazy left" to pressure reformers like FDR into action. Really pathetic the stances you are choosing to embrace. Those stances are not poor people or worker friendly.

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Response to JoePolitics (Reply #52)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 02:00 PM

62. Agreed

I don't support extremists on either side. In fact I would say THEY are the major problem right now. It is sad to see the left embracing such extremism. I thought that was only for cons.

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #31)

Thu Jul 9, 2015, 04:06 PM

84. It's much better to just ignore it . . . like Hillary does.

 

But she's got the wink and the nod down.

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Response to Jack Burton (Original post)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 12:03 PM

56. anyone that has paid attention

in the last fifty years knows that the official rate is percent looking for work. If you paid attention in the past there is always a substantial number that give up. when the economy improves, some go back into the looking for work contingent.

Liberals know the numbers don't include the "I gave up" contingent. It also doesn't include the group that got a job at 20,000 when the last job was being paid 50,000. When you look at the statistics you need to know what you are looking at.

I have no problems believing after the Bush depression/recession there are lots of older people that have become unemployable because of corporate policies. Lots of other people that would like to work but gave up. so, 10% ral unemployment is believable.

Cons want to compare Obama's real unemployed numbers with Bushes official numbers. The fact is the "gave up contingent " exists now and has existed since the labor department started tracking unemployment.

I certainly don't consider the official unemployment numbers reflective the whole story. I would expect any liberal administration to realize the difference.

I would expect any conservative administration to consider the unemployed as lazy moochers and disregard them.

The conversations here certainly would bare that out.

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Response to Junglejim43 (Reply #56)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 12:41 PM

58. "anyone that has paid attention" LULZ!

Ain't that the truth!

But now that we have a little slap fight for the Dem nomination it finally dawns on the Dem establishment cheering section to finally see that distinction.

Again...the administration insists that "unemployment" is 5.3% and the blue team goes wild.

Well, that is until the usurper Saunders says otherwise, then Obama's court defenders fall all over themselves to finally Voxsplain that concept.

Heh...you see, U3 and U6 and blah blah blah. Where the hell have they been for the last 7 years?

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Response to Junglejim43 (Reply #56)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 02:24 PM

65. Why should we feel sorry for this mythically huge....

Number of people that supposedly gave up? There are plenty of jobs out there. I have no sympathy for people who aren't looking.

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #65)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 02:39 PM

66. sure there are

If you are young enough

If you haven't been unemployed for several years.

If you have the right resume

Otherwise, no there aren't.

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Response to Junglejim43 (Reply #66)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 02:42 PM

67. You haven't convinced me...

... To feel sorry for people who will not look for a job. There are 5 million job openings right now.

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Response to Gr8Daze (Reply #65)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 02:46 PM

68. "Are there no prisons? And the Union workhouses. Are they still in operation?"...

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Response to Jack Burton (Original post)

Tue Jul 7, 2015, 09:35 PM

82. Bernie is a fucking idiot, then.

 

There are plenty who work part time because they want to.

Plenty others who opted to go to school or who had worked but no longer need to because they get Medicare or less expensive insurance under Obamacare.

If he said that garbage then I have lost respect for him.

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