Beliefsbeliefsthanksgivingcatholicrootssquanto

Wed Nov 21, 2018, 08:19 PM

How Catholic Squanto Saved the Pilgrims at Thanksgiving

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Reply How Catholic Squanto Saved the Pilgrims at Thanksgiving (Original post)
TM999 Nov 21 OP
Grumpy Pickle Nov 21 #1
TM999 Nov 21 #3
Meowmenow Nov 21 #2
TM999 Nov 21 #4
Meowmenow Nov 22 #5
Qukid Nov 22 #6
TM999 Nov 22 #7

Response to TM999 (Original post)

Wed Nov 21, 2018, 10:42 PM

1. Interesting. I've never heard that before.

TY.

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Response to Grumpy Pickle (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 21, 2018, 10:59 PM

3. A lot of Catholic contributions to history are glossed over in America

as there has sadly been a very strong anti-Catholic bias since our founding.

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Response to TM999 (Original post)

Wed Nov 21, 2018, 10:51 PM

2. What evidence is there that he was Catholic?

 

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Response to Meowmenow (Reply #2)

Wed Nov 21, 2018, 11:29 PM

4. Several actually.

Gorges, Sir Ferdinand. "A Briefe Relation of the Discovery and Plantation of New England", Baxter 1890, I: 203-40 (1622)

Governor William Bradford described Squanto’s death like this:

"Squanto fell ill of Indian fever, bleeding much at the nose, which the Indians take as a symptom of death, and within a few days he died. He begged the Governor to pray for him, that he might go to the Englishman’s God in heaven, and bequeathed several of his things to his English friends, as remembrances. His death was a great loss."

Puritans were virulently anti-Catholic. They left England because they believed the Anglican Church was 'too' Catholic. They deemed Christmas to be a Satanic holiday forbidden to be celebrated.

Thanksgiving is the English translation of the Greek word - eukharistia. The actual first 'thanksgivings' in the America's were celebrated by Spanish settlers and missionaries in what would become Texas and Florida. They sat down for a shared meal with the natives and then celebrated the Mass afterwards.

Pope Paul III declared Native Americans 'true men' who could not be enslaved or deprived of freedom. Franciscans in the US baptized him as was common practice when natives were rescued from slave traders. They would then travel to Spain to be catechized and fully confirmed by Jesuits. These free men then could go to England or America and work which is what Squanto did. First he worked in England then came back to America.



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Response to TM999 (Reply #4)

Thu Nov 22, 2018, 12:12 AM

5. So nothing more than I got off of wikipedia?

 

Which also had this:

"Hunt, according to Gorges, took the Natives to the "Straits" where he sold as many as he could. But when the "Friers of those parts" discovered what he was doing, they took the rest to be "instructed in the Christian Faith; and so disappointed this unworthy fellow of his hopes of gaine …" What basis he had, if any, for this claim is unknown; in fact, it is likely he never met Squanto, at least before 1619. In any event, despite later fictionalized versions of Squanto's life, Gorges makes no claim that he was one of the slaves who were taken up by the friars "to be instructed in the Christian faith" and those who relate his history heard directly from Squanto's mouth (Bradford, Winslow and Pratt) do not relate such an incident."

and

"No records show how long Squanto lived in Spain, what he did there or how he "got away for England" (as Bradford put it). Prowse asserts that he spent four years in slavery in Spain and then was smuggled aboard a ship belonging to Guy's colony, taken to Spain and then to Newfoundland but offers not authority. Smith attested that Squanto lived in England "a good time," although he does not say what he was doing there. Plymouth Governor William Bradford, the Englishman who knew him best (and most sympathetically), recorded that after Spain he lived in Cornhill in the City of London with John Slany ("Master John Slanie"). Slany was a merchant and shipbuilder who became another of the merchant adventurers of London hoping to make money from colonizing projects in America. He was an investor in the East India Company. But more importantly for Squanto he was one of the grantees of the Newfoundland patent and treasurer of the Company of Adventurers and Planters of London and Bristol who were to exploit the grant. This association may have had something to do with obtaining Squanto from Málaga. Slany's motive in housing him was probably no more disinterested than Gorges's in detaining his Natives."

Further,

"Squanto's death

The sickness seems to have greatly shaken Bradford, for they lingered there for several days before he died. Bradford described his death in some detail:

In this place Squanto fell sick of Indian fever, bleeding much at the nose (which the Indians take as a symptom of death) and within a few days died there; desiring the Governor to pray for him, that he might go to the Englishmen's God in Heaven; and bequeathed sundry of his things to English friends, as remembrances of his love; of whom they had a great loss.

Without Squanto to pilot them, the English settlers decided against trying the shoals again and returned to Cape Cod Bay.

The English Separatists may have comforted themselves by believing that Squanto had become a convert, but it is doubtful that he subscribed to Christianity in any orthodox way. William Wood writing a little more than a decade later explained why some of the Ninnimissinuok began recognizing the power of "the Englishmens God, as they call him": "because they could never yet have power by their conjurations to damnifie the English either in body or goods" and since the introduction of the new spirit "the times and seasons being much altered in sever or eight years, freer from lightning and thunder, and long droughts, suddaine and tempestuous dashes of rain, and lamentable cold Winters." Although the English counted Squanto and later Hobomok among their first converts, the two probably "hoped to add the Christian God to their personal arrays" of deities. Willison suggested another reason that Squanto likely wished for heaven: "for he may well have feared what would happen if he chanced to meet Massasoit in the Happy Hunting Grounds." "


Where did this happen? "Franciscans in the US baptized him"

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Response to TM999 (Original post)

Thu Nov 22, 2018, 06:33 AM

6. I wonder if he was molested.

Just kidding, of course he was.

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Response to Qukid (Reply #6)

Thu Nov 22, 2018, 08:04 AM

7. Only if the liberal homosexuals got a hold of him was it possible.

Liberals fuck up everything. Case in point.

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